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Post by Kapitan on Nov 8, 2021 12:21:49 GMT
After Love You, Brian Wilson worked on music that has been called Adult/Child. The album-to-be included previously recorded material as well as new. That project was shelved, and instead Wilson, Mike Love, and Al Jardine decamped to Fairfield, Iowa, with some touring musicians to record what became the bulk of MIU (i.e., Maharishi International University).
A month before that album was released, they released their single from that album. In late August 1978, the Al Jardine-sung "Peggy Sue" dropped with the Adult/Child leftover "Hey Little Tomboy" as the B-side.
The A-side reached #59 on the Billboard charts.
Please discuss and rate "Peggy Sue" and "Hey Little Tomboy."
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Nov 8, 2021 13:06:33 GMT
I actually heard "Peggy Sue" on the radio...once. I don't think it's a bad cover. It could've been better; the arrangement/mix is a little bland. The ending is a little confusing. Do they want to fade out or abruptly stop - with a synthesizer (is that what that instrument is)? However - and listen to it! - "Peggy Sue" might be Al Jardine's best lead vocal EVER. He nails it!
By recording and now releasing "Hey Little Tomboy", the band proves two things - they're nuts and they didn't have a clue. The song isn't even that good. Why did they keep pursuing it? And all of the other songs on MIU that would've made cool B-sides...
"Peggy Sue" wasn't a terrible choice for a single. It's interesting that they bypassed "Come Go With Me" which actually did become a hit single. "Peggy Sue" was safe. It was Al who could still sing. It was Buddy Holly (well, kind of ). Were they trying to duplicate the success of Rock And Roll Music"? Was this More 15 Big Ones? And with the B-side (see "TM Song" and "Solar System"; how'd that work out)? It's hard to give this one a good rating. How about a 5, salvaged only by Al's great vocal.
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Post by kds on Nov 8, 2021 13:15:36 GMT
I'll go with a five. I don't think Peggy Sue is one of the Beach Boys better covers, even for this era.
Hey Little Tomboy is an alright song, but an odd choice for a single IMO, though I'm not sure what the better option might've been, since, other than Come and Go with Me, nothing on MIU really screams single to me.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Nov 8, 2021 13:21:33 GMT
I'll go with a five. I don't think Peggy Sue is one of the Beach Boys better covers, even for this era. Hey Little Tomboy is an alright song, but an odd choice for a single IMO, though I'm not sure what the better option might've been, since, other than Come and Go with Me, nothing on MIU really screams single to me. If they wanted to go with their tried-and-true fast/slow, rock & roll/ballad format, they could've used "My Diane" or "Winds Of Change" as B-sides, though I think the former is overrated. Somehow, I would've tried to get "Match Point Of Our Love"...heard. And "Pitter Patter".
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Post by kds on Nov 8, 2021 13:23:14 GMT
I'll go with a five. I don't think Peggy Sue is one of the Beach Boys better covers, even for this era. Hey Little Tomboy is an alright song, but an odd choice for a single IMO, though I'm not sure what the better option might've been, since, other than Come and Go with Me, nothing on MIU really screams single to me. If they wanted to go with their tried-and-true fast/slow, rock & roll/ballad format, they could've used "My Diane" or "Winds Of Change" as B-sides, though I think the former is overrated. Somehow, I would've tried to get "Match Point Of Our Love"...heard. And "Pitter Patter". I'm a fan of My Diane, but I think it tends to be a little overrated mostly because of the album its on.
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Post by Kapitan on Nov 8, 2021 13:51:35 GMT
I actually heard "Peggy Sue" ... Do they want to fade out or abruptly stop - with a synthesizer (is that what that instrument is)?
I believe it's a guitar playing lead licks with a very heavy phaser effect. (You can hear the effect a little less prominently on things like KISS's "Rocket Ride," all over Lou Reed's Rock 'n' Roll Animal, including in the intro to "Sweet Jane," and Zeppelin's "Nobody's Fault But Mine." Phasers, and their cousins, flangers, were really common in the '70s, for whatever reason. But here, it is off to one side (left) and in such a full mix--drums, bass guitar, bass synth, piano, several guitars, background harmonies, saxes, handclaps--that you don't hear a lot of it until things fade at the end. But it sounds like it's a guitar doing little blues-rock licks under heavy phasing.
I'm really nonplussed by this single. "Peggy Sue" sounds fine, but it is what I'd now think of as an album track or a donation to a tribute album. I suppose it was in that era of '50s nostalgia (which they had already milked two years prior), but there is something almost a little sad about the decision to do it, for me. "Rock and Roll Music" was a moderate hit? Great! Let's keep doing '50s songs!
"Hey Little Tomboy" is a mediocre track with lyrics best ignored and terrible vocals by Brian. ("They're doin' it all over the world," etc.) I have often wondered how Carl could try to infuse any passion to "time to turn you into a girl," without just asking, "what the fuck are you doing here?" It's at best pathetic and at worst pretty sick. A bunch of fat, bearded thirty-something men singing about an apparently just pubescent girl "becoming a woman" is just not cool.
I do like the little musical figure that kicks off the bridge at 1:35 or so. Thank god they took out the narration about shaving her legs "for the very first time."
I'm leaning toward a 4, balancing uninspired, noncreative competence on the A-side with something worse on the B-side.
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Post by lonelysummer on Nov 8, 2021 20:18:09 GMT
If they wanted to go with their tried-and-true fast/slow, rock & roll/ballad format, they could've used "My Diane" or "Winds Of Change" as B-sides, though I think the former is overrated. Somehow, I would've tried to get "Match Point Of Our Love"...heard. And "Pitter Patter". I'm a fan of My Diane, but I think it tends to be a little overrated mostly because of the album its on. And because of who sings it. C'mon, it's Dennis singing, the man who created that masterpiece Pacific Ocean Blue, so it's gotta be awesome! As a song, it's okay, and Dennis does a decent job of singing it, but hey, it's not River Song or Cuddle Up. Hey Little Tomboy? Was this aimed at the new generation of fans brought in by Endless Summer? I'm sure by 1977 those fans had moved on to something a little more challenging, like Shaun Cassidy, or Leif Garrett. Peggy Sue is a passable cover, but can't hold a candle to the original. I'm gonna give this turkey a 4. Should have been released just in time for Thanksgiving Day! Will these guys ever get it right? Well, yeah, sometimes. It speaks of how far these guys have fallen that I'm actually looking forward to rating their disco single!
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Post by kds on Nov 8, 2021 20:30:32 GMT
I'm a fan of My Diane, but I think it tends to be a little overrated mostly because of the album its on. And because of who sings it. C'mon, it's Dennis singing, the man who created that masterpiece Pacific Ocean Blue, so it's gotta be awesome! As a song, it's okay, and Dennis does a decent job of singing it, but hey, it's not River Song or Cuddle Up. Hey Little Tomboy? Was this aimed at the new generation of fans brought in by Endless Summer? I'm sure by 1977 those fans had moved on to something a little more challenging, like Shaun Cassidy, or Leif Garrett. Peggy Sue is a passable cover, but can't hold a candle to the original. I'm gonna give this turkey a 4. Should have been released just in time for Thanksgiving Day! Will these guys ever get it right? Well, yeah, sometimes. It speaks of how far these guys have fallen that I'm actually looking forward to rating their disco single! Dennis's vocals are another reason, but when it's on an album with She's Got Rhythm, Hey Little Tomboy, and Kona Coast (which I actually like, but those later day summer callback songs aren't so popular), it's no surprise it's been a little overrated.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Nov 8, 2021 21:53:40 GMT
I'm a fan of My Diane, but I think it tends to be a little overrated mostly because of the album its on. And because of who sings it. C'mon, it's Dennis singing, the man who created that masterpiece Pacific Ocean Blue, so it's gotta be awesome! As a song, it's okay, and Dennis does a decent job of singing it, but hey, it's not River Song or Cuddle Up. Hey Little Tomboy? Was this aimed at the new generation of fans brought in by Endless Summer? I'm sure by 1977 those fans had moved on to something a little more challenging, like Shaun Cassidy, or Leif Garrett. Peggy Sue is a passable cover, but can't hold a candle to the original. I'm gonna give this turkey a 4. Should have been released just in time for Thanksgiving Day! Will these guys ever get it right? Well, yeah, sometimes. It speaks of how far these guys have fallen that I'm actually looking forward to rating their disco single! Yes, when "Peggy Sue" is your first and only single, it does speak to how far they had fallen. The funny thing is, I like M.I.U. Album and always enjoyed it. Oh, it could've been a better album with an addition or two here and a subtraction or two there. But, yeah, there were certainly no aces or timeless classics like most of their previous albums. I know it probably would've stiffed if it had been released as a single, but I could hear "Match Point Of Our Love" being played on the radio, like a light summer song (maybe even on FM radio) or an end of summer into fall single. Brian never sang better in his post-1974 incarnation and the music almost sounded contemporary.
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Post by kds on Nov 9, 2021 16:34:09 GMT
In general, I like the MIU album too, but very little on that album has "hit single" written on it IMO.
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Post by Kapitan on Nov 9, 2021 20:35:39 GMT
I actually almost agree with the earlier thoughts about "Pitter Patter" or "Matchpoint of Our Love." They're stupid, to be sure, but they are two of the better-sounding original songs on the album. And maybe that kind of easy listening would have been appealing at the time, I don't know. I know there was soft rock/pop that was popular, and the Beach Boys' fans were presumably aging into that crowd.
At the very least one of them probably could or should have been the B-side.
Or they could have gone a nostalgia route without settling for covers with "Wontcha Come Out Tonight" and "Sweet Sunday Kind of Love." I even like "She's Got Rhythm," but Brian sounds awful with that squealing, pained falsetto.
But to be clear, I don't think any of those alternatives were going to be big hits or make the album have a bigger impact, really. Maybe just a bit on the margins.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Nov 9, 2021 21:08:27 GMT
I actually almost agree with the earlier thoughts about "Pitter Patter" or "Matchpoint of Our Love." They're stupid, to be sure, but they are two of the better-sounding original songs on the album. And maybe that kind of easy listening would have been appealing at the time, I don't know. I know there was soft rock/pop that was popular, and the Beach Boys' fans were presumably aging into that crowd.
At the very least one of them probably could or should have been the B-side.
Or they could have gone a nostalgia route without settling for covers with "Wontcha Come Out Tonight" and "Sweet Sunday Kind of Love." I even like "She's Got Rhythm," but Brian sounds awful with that squealing, pained falsetto.
But to be clear, I don't think any of those alternatives were going to be big hits or make the album have a bigger impact, really. Maybe just a bit on the margins.
Almost agree?
As popular as the Beach Boys were during The Big Comeback in 1976, it still seemed like fans - both casual Beach Boys and general fans - were only interested in old Beach Boys-like music. It seemed like even they (the group) stepped out just a little, people didn't want to hear it. Note the 70's hits - "Rock And Roll Music", kind of "It's OK", "The Beach Boys Medley", "Come Go With Me", "Good Timin'", and even "Almost Summer" - all had that "classic BB sound". Was "Pitter Ppatter" and "Match Point" and even "Wontcha Come Out Tonight" NOT Beach Boys enough? Prob'ly.
Oh, and there's nothing wrong with Brian's vocal on "She's Got Rhythm". I would've taken that ANY TIME in the ensuing 43 years!
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Post by Kapitan on Nov 9, 2021 21:12:52 GMT
Oh, and there's nothing wrong with Brian's vocal on "She's Got Rhythm". I would've taken that ANY TIME in the ensuing 43 years! Other than BWPS, I think that is our biggest disagreement about the Beach Boys. I think it's one of the single worst notes (each time he does it) in the history of the band. Worse than nails on a chalkboard. There is no way they should have let him do that part.
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Post by lonelysummer on Nov 10, 2021 4:47:31 GMT
I actually almost agree with the earlier thoughts about "Pitter Patter" or "Matchpoint of Our Love." They're stupid, to be sure, but they are two of the better-sounding original songs on the album. And maybe that kind of easy listening would have been appealing at the time, I don't know. I know there was soft rock/pop that was popular, and the Beach Boys' fans were presumably aging into that crowd.
At the very least one of them probably could or should have been the B-side.
Or they could have gone a nostalgia route without settling for covers with "Wontcha Come Out Tonight" and "Sweet Sunday Kind of Love." I even like "She's Got Rhythm," but Brian sounds awful with that squealing, pained falsetto.
This last statement I agree with. He does sound better for the most part on MIU than on 15BO and Love You, but I would not play "She's Got Rhythm" for anyone as proof of what a great singer was. I think of MIU as an album where the Boys are pandering to their percieved audience; songs about surfing, girls - young girls, remakes of 50s hits, basically trying to be an All Summer Long for the 70's, instead of just being who they were at that point in time. Or maybe that IS who they were in 78 - a bunch of aging rockers with nothing left in their tank except empty odes to cars, girls, and the beach. But even weak Beach Boys music can be somewhat enjoyable. And the way I feel about those records now is, we were lucky to have the original lineup together as long as we did.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Nov 10, 2021 12:55:47 GMT
I actually almost agree with the earlier thoughts about "Pitter Patter" or "Matchpoint of Our Love." They're stupid, to be sure, but they are two of the better-sounding original songs on the album. And maybe that kind of easy listening would have been appealing at the time, I don't know. I know there was soft rock/pop that was popular, and the Beach Boys' fans were presumably aging into that crowd.
At the very least one of them probably could or should have been the B-side.
Or they could have gone a nostalgia route without settling for covers with "Wontcha Come Out Tonight" and "Sweet Sunday Kind of Love." I even like "She's Got Rhythm," but Brian sounds awful with that squealing, pained falsetto.
I think of MIU as an album where the Boys are pandering to their percieved audience; songs about surfing, girls - young girls, remakes of 50s hits, basically trying to be an All Summer Long for the 70's, instead of just being who they were at that point in time. Or maybe that IS who they were in 78 - a bunch of aging rockers with nothing left in their tank except empty odes to cars, girls, and the beach. But even weak Beach Boys music can be somewhat enjoyable. And the way I feel about those records now is, we were lucky to have the original lineup together as long as we did. I always felt, with M.I.U. Album, the Beach Boys were in but not all in. That is, I think they wanted to "go back" to music and subjects that they thought their fans wanted, but they couldn't totally commit to it. You have good old boy/girl songs, but then you have "Belles Of Paris" and "Winds Of Change". You have a song about surfing/Hawaii, then you have a song about going to a disco. You had two oldies (both from the 50's and both on the same album side), and then "Match Point Of Our Love". And, you have "Hey Little Tomboy" which doesn't fit in anywhere. Yes, M.I.U. feels a little retro, no doubt about it, but not totally. It really is a mixed bag.
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