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Post by Kapitan on Nov 10, 2021 13:24:48 GMT
I think it's key to remembering the state of the band itself at this time: abysmal. One of the real low points of the band in terms of cohesion. So to expect anything other than a mixed bag might be unrealistic. Neither Carl nor Dennis even went to MIU for the recording, did they? If I recall, it was just Mike, Al, and Brian plus the musicians.
My point being, it just makes sense that the results would be neither fish nor fowl. (To say nothing of how different much of LA was, as if they gave Mike, Al, and Brian an album; then Dennis and Carl got an album.) Bizarre synth-only tunes, covers and oldies, retro self-pastiche, easy listening, soft rock, yacht rock, disco: they covered a lot of ground in those few years of 1977-79, but it was more wandering than exploration in my opinion.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Nov 10, 2021 13:29:52 GMT
I think it's key to remembering the state of the band itself at this time: abysmal. One of the real low points of the band in terms of cohesion. So to expect anything other than a mixed bag might be unrealistic. Neither Carl nor Dennis even went to MIU for the recording, did they? If I recall, it was just Mike, Al, and Brian plus the musicians.
My point being, it just makes sense that the results would be neither fish nor fowl. (To say nothing of how different much of LA was, as if they gave Mike, Al, and Brian an album; then Dennis and Carl got an album.) Bizarre synth-only tunes, covers and oldies, retro self-pastiche, easy listening, soft rock, yacht rock, disco: they covered a lot of ground in those few years of 1977-79, but it was more wandering than exploration in my opinion.
Yes, and it probably would've been even more of a mixed bag HAD Dennis contributed any songs.
The Beach Boys did kind of the same thing with Keepin' The Summer Alive. It's not exactly summer-y is it?
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Post by Kapitan on Nov 10, 2021 21:50:34 GMT
The Beach Boys did kind of the same thing with Keepin' The Summer Alive. It's not exactly summer-y is it? While I don't rate KTSA very highly, I don't think of it as aimless so much as just mediocre. I also don't see the lack of a summer feeling as an issue. I'll grant you don't have a lot of songs specifically about summer, but I don't mind that anyway: I don't think it's so big a deal to have a concept (or not).
So whatever issues I have with it, they're different ones from what I have with the MIU material.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Nov 11, 2021 0:51:13 GMT
Two more things on M.I.U. Album and Keepin' The Summer Alive...
I have read several reviews - by writers/critics and BB fans - on M.I.U. Album, and almost all of them describe the album as a return to the group's earlier "glory days", both in their sound and subjects. However, I don't hear M.I.U. that way and never did. First, I'll point out the easiest - Dennis sure doesn't sound like his old self on "My Diane". And, Carl is barely audible on the album. How about Brian? While he sings spectacularly, he certainly doesn't sound like the BW of 1962-66, either with his lead vocals (which again are great) or his high voice on the harmonies. The subjects? Disco dancing, Paris, tennis, the weather, changing a tomboy into a girl, and getting older. All Summer Long it ain't! Yes, Mike and Al on M.I.U. do resemble the Mike and Al of the eralier years, but not enough to...take me back...to another time.
You know, how hard was it to make Keepin' The Summer Alive sound like an album that was keepin' the summer alive? This was right in their wheelhouse. And then things went astray. I love "Nothing But A Heartache" and "Santa Ana Winds", but summer-y they ain't. Nor "School Days", nor "Endless Harmony". I won't even address "When Girls Get Together". To start with, the concept to even attempt/call the album "Keepin' The Summer Alive" was a questionable one. But the execution was even worse. And it shouldn't have been.
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Post by lonelysummer on Nov 11, 2021 5:05:38 GMT
I think it's key to remembering the state of the band itself at this time: abysmal. One of the real low points of the band in terms of cohesion. So to expect anything other than a mixed bag might be unrealistic. Neither Carl nor Dennis even went to MIU for the recording, did they? If I recall, it was just Mike, Al, and Brian plus the musicians.
My point being, it just makes sense that the results would be neither fish nor fowl. (To say nothing of how different much of LA was, as if they gave Mike, Al, and Brian an album; then Dennis and Carl got an album.) Bizarre synth-only tunes, covers and oldies, retro self-pastiche, easy listening, soft rock, yacht rock, disco: they covered a lot of ground in those few years of 1977-79, but it was more wandering than exploration in my opinion.
I thought Carl was there. He talked on a radio show about how good that move was for them - living in a place where it was real simple.
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Post by kds on Nov 11, 2021 12:52:46 GMT
Wasn't the backing track for Peggy Sue originally intended for one of the Christmas songs of that era?
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Nov 11, 2021 12:58:18 GMT
Wasn't the backing track for Peggy Sue originally intended for one of the Christmas songs of that era? It was used for "Christmas Time Is Here Again" which appeared on Ultimate Christmas.
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Post by kds on Nov 11, 2021 13:02:31 GMT
Wasn't the backing track for Peggy Sue originally intended for one of the Christmas songs of that era? It was used for "Christmas Time Is Here Again" which appeared on Ultimate Christmas.
Thank you, I had a brain cramp there.
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Post by Kapitan on Nov 11, 2021 14:38:42 GMT
I think it's key to remembering the state of the band itself at this time: abysmal. One of the real low points of the band in terms of cohesion. So to expect anything other than a mixed bag might be unrealistic. Neither Carl nor Dennis even went to MIU for the recording, did they? If I recall, it was just Mike, Al, and Brian plus the musicians. I thought Carl was there. He talked on a radio show about how good that move was for them - living in a place where it was real simple. Certainly possible I'm wrong: I'll be honest, I was going by memory on that statement-question. This morning I've been consulting books but haven't found an answer. If anyone can point to something more definitive, I'd like to see it. (That said, I'd bet that even if Carl said that, he was putting on a good face for the interview. He certainly was not aligned with Love-Jardine at that point in terms of business, direction, style, production, material, or anything else, as far as I can tell.)
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Post by lonelysummer on Nov 11, 2021 21:22:49 GMT
I thought Carl was there. He talked on a radio show about how good that move was for them - living in a place where it was real simple. Certainly possible I'm wrong: I'll be honest, I was going by memory on that statement-question. This morning I've been consulting books but haven't found an answer. If anyone can point to something more definitive, I'd like to see it. (That said, I'd bet that even if Carl said that, he was putting on a good face for the interview. He certainly was not aligned with Love-Jardine at that point in terms of business, direction, style, production, material, or anything else, as far as I can tell.) The dj on the radio show asked him about the report of a big blow up in Rolling Stone, and Carl said he didn't read the article. He said "I don't read anything about us. Dennis read it, and he thought it was pretty funny". Then he went on to talk about how things had been more harmonious in the band since the incident. Knowing what we know now, I think Carl was trying to be diplomatic, and not ruffle anybody's feathers. My friend had dated the interview as November 1978, but I did a little research, and it had to have been Nov. 1977 - which makes it BEFORE the disastrous tour down under, and before Carl got clean and sober.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Nov 11, 2021 23:30:43 GMT
This is totally from memory, so I stand to be corrected, but I thought I read/heard that Carl made a very brief appearance at M.I.U., maybe even just for a day or two. We know he sang lead on "Sweet Sunday Kinda Love", and I think he sang on a couple of the Christmas songs ("Go And Get That Girl" being one). I don't know if his vocal on "Hey Little Tomboy" was recorded at M.I.U. or left on from the earlier version. Same with his guitar playing. Carl Wilson is on the M.I.U. Album credits for "guitar", but maybe it's for "Peggy Sue" and "Come Go With Me", which like "Hey Little Tomboy", could've been recorded at earlier sessions. One last thing...I think I've seen Carl in the Our Team video during some scenes from M.I.U. I guess it's kind of technicality. Yes, Carl was there, but really, what was his impact?
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Post by B.E. on Nov 12, 2021 1:40:06 GMT
I kinda feel bad rounding down to a '5' but that's where I'm at. That also makes it my least favorite single up to this point. I love the song "Peggy Sue' and it's a great lead by Al, but I have mixed feelings on the background vocals, and the backing track/arrangement is both bland and misfit. I like the bass (especially the run at around 1:46), drums, and handclaps. Not crazy about the sound of the tack piano (?), the tone/style of the lead guitar playing, the Christmas bells we hear in the beginning, or the outer space-sounding phased guitar we hear at the end. Outside of Al's lead, while wholly competent, just not great production IMO. Granted, I'm a bigger fan of 15 Big Ones than most, but it occurred to me today that I actually prefer every cover on that album to this.
As for "Hey Little Tomboy", I kinda like the song musically, but there's really no excuse for the lyrics and the vocals are pretty bad. Especially Carl's. I actually think Brian's are passable but they are mixed SO DAMN LOUD in certain spots that it's very unflattering. That little interlude from 1:36-1:40 is really nice, but it leads us to 10 seconds of nothing but plodding. It really sounds unfinished there. It reminds me of the 20 seconds of nothingness in "Johnny Carson" which starts at about 1:56. I think in reviewing MIU in the past I may have opined that "Hey Little Tomboy" should have been left off the album (to only appear as a B-side). Well, now that I'm reviewing the singles, I'm thinking maybe it just shouldn't have been released. (That said, I'd rather have it than not.)
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Post by B.E. on Nov 12, 2021 1:49:31 GMT
Oh, and while it's super easy to say in hindsight, I think I'd either have gone all-in '50s nostalgia with "Come Go With Me"/"Peggy Sue" or, more likely, with what I consider the best: "Come Go With Me"/"My Diane".
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Nov 12, 2021 12:06:01 GMT
I kinda feel bad rounding down to a '5' but that's where I'm at. That also makes it my least favorite single up to this point. That's where I'm at, too. I gave the single a 5, but I think "Peggy Sue" deserved/deserves a better fate. It really isn't that bad; actually a lot of it is pretty good. I already mentioned Al's great lead vocal, but the recording has some other merits. The intro isn't bad, the drumming is good, and the chorus/background vocals ("Peggy Sue, Peggy Sue, pretty, pretty, pretty, pretty Peggy Sue" kind of rock, with that "whew" thrown in there). The song wants to rock...more...but like I alluded to above, the mix prohibits it. I think I'm going to re-vote and give this single a 6. I won't let "Hey Little Tomboy" drag it down to a 5.
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Post by Kapitan on Nov 13, 2021 13:51:50 GMT
If we throw out the lyrics to "Hey Little Tomboy" and consider it on purely musical terms--both the instrumental track and the vocal parts/melody minus words--does that change anyone's impression?
I ask because while the slightly nauseating lyrics are often what gets mentioned (including by me), honestly I can't say I'd be much kinder to it if it had really strong lyrics. You'd lose the "ick" factor, but then you'd be left with the "meh" factor that is the bane of MIU and, in my opinion, a lot of post-Holland Beach Boys. You're left with something recognizable as Beach Boys, but more like a shadow of what you know and love as Beach Boys. Fourth-rate stuff. It isn't terrible, but it's certainly not particularly good. Maybe if it had another section to change things up. Some melody added to pique one's interest. Something.
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