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Post by Kapitan on Jul 26, 2019 17:18:43 GMT
Top Ten Bands I'm Indifferent Towards - I might like a song here or there, and might even own an album or two, but I'm not really moved either way to really call myself a fan. 1. Dream Theater - Back in 1992, I heard an amazing song called Pull Me Under on the radio. The album that contained the song is actually one my earliest CD purchases. I've tried, but nothing else in their catalog really does much for me. I even saw them open for Iron Maiden in 2010, and other than Pull Me Under, I thought it was pretty meh. 2. The Foo Fighters - They had a couple songs in the late 90s I liked, and their cover of Have a Cigar, featuring Brian May is pretty good. But, overall, I think they're pretty generic. I saw them in concert too back when I worked in radio. 3. Red Hot Chili Peppers - There might actually be five songs over the last 30+ years of there's that I like. I think they're good musicians, and a unique band. I don't rush to change the station when they come on the radio, nor do I find myself compelled to seek out any of their material. 4. The Black Crowes - I could go the rest of my life without ever hearing Hot to Handle again. Some OK songs. Although I do wish I'd have checked out their tour with Jimmy Page in 2000. Had I known at the time that it was going to be a full set of Zeppelin songs, I'd have gone. 5. Slayer - They are supposedly one of the essential all time heavy metal bands. I don't think they're bad, but I don't hear the greatness either. 6. Jet - One of several retro sounding bands that emerged to "save rock" in the early 00s. Even my father, who thinks less of modern rock than I do, loved their debut. I think it's got some moments. But, nothing overly memorable. 7. Stone Temple Pilots - Once Scott Weiland stopped doing an Eddie Vedder impression, there are actually some decent songs. I actually own a comp that I got as a promo when I was in radio, but I never listen to it. 8. Green Day - Perhaps the first pop punk band. I was about to start high school with Dookie was released, and I think everybody had a copy but me. I do like their acoustic ballad Time of Your Life, but I don't like it enough to go online to buy the album. 9. The Cure - Love Song was decent. But, I never got the love that this band gets. 10. Radiohead - I love the song Paranoid Android, and I remember watching the trippy animated video multiple times in the summer of 1997. I eventually bought the OK Computer album, but found it underwhelming. I basically agree. My dissenting opinion would be on Radiohead, which I thought was really good from The Bends through Amnesiac (so roughly 1996 through 2002?). Four albums. During that time, I thought they were creative and interesting. I really enjoyed it. Especially OK Computer and Kid A (which was famously hated, especially in a review in I think the New Yorker, basically saying "I don't have time for this nonsense").
I really enjoyed the Black Crowes' debut when it came out: it was one of the few relatively raw, bluesy harder rock n roll bands of that era. But it was as derivative as you can be, and once I knew that album, I felt I knew the band. I never heard anything that made me think otherwise. They always just struck me as a bar band, frankly.
The others, I can't even name a song by half of them. I realize Foo Fighters and STP are considered some of the great (only?) rock bands of the past 30 years, but I can't name a song by either. (I remember having known a few of STP's early hits, but I don't recall them anymore. I just recall having hated them.)
Red Hot Chili Peppers and Green Day never did it for me. RHCP were annoying, always. Green Day: why does the lead singer have a faux British accent when he sings?
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Jul 26, 2019 17:23:34 GMT
I thought I'd post it. My favorite part is the "Nothing's for free. Take it away boys..." part. I can't help singing along.
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Post by kds on Jul 26, 2019 17:23:54 GMT
Top Ten Bands I'm Indifferent Towards - I might like a song here or there, and might even own an album or two, but I'm not really moved either way to really call myself a fan. 1. Dream Theater - Back in 1992, I heard an amazing song called Pull Me Under on the radio. The album that contained the song is actually one my earliest CD purchases. I've tried, but nothing else in their catalog really does much for me. I even saw them open for Iron Maiden in 2010, and other than Pull Me Under, I thought it was pretty meh. 2. The Foo Fighters - They had a couple songs in the late 90s I liked, and their cover of Have a Cigar, featuring Brian May is pretty good. But, overall, I think they're pretty generic. I saw them in concert too back when I worked in radio. 3. Red Hot Chili Peppers - There might actually be five songs over the last 30+ years of there's that I like. I think they're good musicians, and a unique band. I don't rush to change the station when they come on the radio, nor do I find myself compelled to seek out any of their material. 4. The Black Crowes - I could go the rest of my life without ever hearing Hot to Handle again. Some OK songs. Although I do wish I'd have checked out their tour with Jimmy Page in 2000. Had I known at the time that it was going to be a full set of Zeppelin songs, I'd have gone. 5. Slayer - They are supposedly one of the essential all time heavy metal bands. I don't think they're bad, but I don't hear the greatness either. 6. Jet - One of several retro sounding bands that emerged to "save rock" in the early 00s. Even my father, who thinks less of modern rock than I do, loved their debut. I think it's got some moments. But, nothing overly memorable. 7. Stone Temple Pilots - Once Scott Weiland stopped doing an Eddie Vedder impression, there are actually some decent songs. I actually own a comp that I got as a promo when I was in radio, but I never listen to it. 8. Green Day - Perhaps the first pop punk band. I was about to start high school with Dookie was released, and I think everybody had a copy but me. I do like their acoustic ballad Time of Your Life, but I don't like it enough to go online to buy the album. 9. The Cure - Love Song was decent. But, I never got the love that this band gets. 10. Radiohead - I love the song Paranoid Android, and I remember watching the trippy animated video multiple times in the summer of 1997. I eventually bought the OK Computer album, but found it underwhelming. Do you know that I do not own a single album by any of the above bands? Stone Temple Pilots have a song that is one of my all-timers - "Big Bang Baby" - but never bought an album. I thought Scott Weiland was a great talent and a tragedy who couldn't save himself. So many people tried.
Red Hot Chili Peppers have two songs that I love - "Under The Bridge" and "Give It Away" - and a comp by them may be in my future purchases. I always thought that band was very talented, too. I know some people don't care for Anthony Kiedis but I think he's a good frontman. He's lucky to be alive. Hillel didn't make it.
Big Bang Baby actually changed my opinion on Weiland. It seems like that was around the time he started using his natural voice. I do like his work on the two Velvet Revolver albums, and saw him in concert with them. Very good frontman.
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Post by kds on Jul 26, 2019 17:29:23 GMT
Top Ten Bands I'm Indifferent Towards - I might like a song here or there, and might even own an album or two, but I'm not really moved either way to really call myself a fan. 1. Dream Theater - Back in 1992, I heard an amazing song called Pull Me Under on the radio. The album that contained the song is actually one my earliest CD purchases. I've tried, but nothing else in their catalog really does much for me. I even saw them open for Iron Maiden in 2010, and other than Pull Me Under, I thought it was pretty meh. 2. The Foo Fighters - They had a couple songs in the late 90s I liked, and their cover of Have a Cigar, featuring Brian May is pretty good. But, overall, I think they're pretty generic. I saw them in concert too back when I worked in radio. 3. Red Hot Chili Peppers - There might actually be five songs over the last 30+ years of there's that I like. I think they're good musicians, and a unique band. I don't rush to change the station when they come on the radio, nor do I find myself compelled to seek out any of their material. 4. The Black Crowes - I could go the rest of my life without ever hearing Hot to Handle again. Some OK songs. Although I do wish I'd have checked out their tour with Jimmy Page in 2000. Had I known at the time that it was going to be a full set of Zeppelin songs, I'd have gone. 5. Slayer - They are supposedly one of the essential all time heavy metal bands. I don't think they're bad, but I don't hear the greatness either. 6. Jet - One of several retro sounding bands that emerged to "save rock" in the early 00s. Even my father, who thinks less of modern rock than I do, loved their debut. I think it's got some moments. But, nothing overly memorable. 7. Stone Temple Pilots - Once Scott Weiland stopped doing an Eddie Vedder impression, there are actually some decent songs. I actually own a comp that I got as a promo when I was in radio, but I never listen to it. 8. Green Day - Perhaps the first pop punk band. I was about to start high school with Dookie was released, and I think everybody had a copy but me. I do like their acoustic ballad Time of Your Life, but I don't like it enough to go online to buy the album. 9. The Cure - Love Song was decent. But, I never got the love that this band gets. 10. Radiohead - I love the song Paranoid Android, and I remember watching the trippy animated video multiple times in the summer of 1997. I eventually bought the OK Computer album, but found it underwhelming. I basically agree. My dissenting opinion would be on Radiohead, which I thought was really good from The Bends through Amnesiac (so roughly 1996 through 2002?). Four albums. During that time, I thought they were creative and interesting. I really enjoyed it. Especially OK Computer and Kid A (which was famously hated, especially in a review in I think the New Yorker, basically saying "I don't have time for this nonsense").
I really enjoyed the Black Crowes' debut when it came out: it was one of the few relatively raw, bluesy harder rock n roll bands of that era. But it was as derivative as you can be, and once I knew that album, I felt I knew the band. I never heard anything that made me think otherwise. They always just struck me as a bar band, frankly.
The others, I can't even name a song by half of them. I realize Foo Fighters and STP are considered some of the great (only?) rock bands of the past 30 years, but I can't name a song by either. (I remember having known a few of STP's early hits, but I don't recall them anymore. I just recall having hated them.)
Red Hot Chili Peppers and Green Day never did it for me. RHCP were annoying, always. Green Day: why does the lead singer have a faux British accent when he sings?
That's pretty much my assessment of The Black Crowes as well. I remember when Jet came out telling somebody that they reminded me of The Black Crowes in that they were very derivative, and not all that good. I used to find the Chili Peppers much more annoying back in the mid 1990s, but as I got older, I noticed that John Frusciante is actually a really good guitarist. And every seven years or so, they put out a song I like. I'm actually more annoyed now that they don't have a better collection of songs, considering the talent level in the band.
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Post by Kapitan on Jul 26, 2019 17:40:52 GMT
I'm actually more annoyed now that they don't have a better collection of songs, considering the talent level in the band. Lots of years with lots of heroin. Not a great recipe for quality productivity.
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Post by kds on Jul 26, 2019 17:48:21 GMT
I'm actually more annoyed now that they don't have a better collection of songs, considering the talent level in the band. Lots of years with lots of heroin. Not a great recipe for quality productivity. This is true. I also tend not to like their faster, funkier material. I guess those songs are good for those who are into that stuff.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Jul 27, 2019 13:54:08 GMT
10 Overrated Beach Boys-related...things...(in no particular order):
01 Bambu 02 "Soulful Old Man Sunshine" 03 That Lucky Old Sun 04 the early version of "Big Sur" 05 the In Concert version of "Marcella" 06 Matt Jardine's recent live vocals 07 "Funky Pretty" 08 The Beach Boys' Christmas Album 09 Wild Honey 10 Love And Mercy (the movie)
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Post by Kapitan on Jul 27, 2019 14:00:35 GMT
Fightin' words on a few fronts!
Mine, hastily assembled. I didn't repeat those of SJS's that I agree with (e.g. Funky Pretty).
1. Dennis Wilson's music in general 2. The idea of Brian as psychedelic or avant garde
3. Al's current voice. (It's still VERY GOOD for someone his age but when people try to insist it's literally as good as ever, that's just nonsense.) 4. Smiley Smile 5. The caricatures of the boys' personalities, especially as used to "explain" (i.e., "make shit up") episodes in their past. 6. Quotes from docs, especially when used by fans to "explain"...
7. Blondie's guitar work 8. Love You (which I love, but seriously) 9. Magic of family. (How everything is/would be better with more family members involved, as if it were an absolute monarchy in which familial lines mattered so much. It's mostly nostalgia, people!) 10. Today Side Two.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Jul 27, 2019 14:42:48 GMT
Fightin' words on a few fronts!
Mine, hastily assembled. I didn't repeat those of SJS's that I agree with (e.g. Funky Pretty).
1. Dennis Wilson's music in general 2. The idea of Brian as psychedelic or avant garde
3. Al's current voice. (It's still VERY GOOD for someone his age but when people try to insist it's literally as good as ever, that's just nonsense.) 4. Smiley Smile 5. The caricatures of the boys' personalities, especially as used to "explain" (i.e., "make shit up") episodes in their past. 6. Quotes from docs, especially when used by fans to "explain"...
7. Blondie's guitar work 8. Love You (which I love, but seriously) 9. Magic of family. (How everything is/would be better with more family members involved, as if it were an absolute monarchy in which familial lines mattered so much. It's mostly nostalgia, people!) 10. Today Side Two.
1. Dennis's songs on the late 60's/early 70's BB albums served the very important role of picking of the slack created by Brian's withdrawal from the group. Most of Dennis' music during that period was excellent. It's a tragedy that he pulled his songs from Surf's Up. And, Pacific Ocean Blue, in my opinion, still remains the best Beach Boys' solo album.
2. I would consider SMiLE and Smiley Smile both psychedelic and avant garde. Other than that small window (late 1966/early 1967), no, Brian's music wasn't psychedelic or avant garde.
3. Agree. It's mostly because of the comparison to the present-day Brian Wilson and Mike Love live vocals.
4. Agree very much. No one "thing" had as significant negative or devastating effect on the group. They never really recovered.
5. Agree again. And we really don't know what went on behind closed doors. Despite all of the stories we have heard and read, we would probably still be shocked to find out the truth.
6. See No. 5.
7. Oh, I don't know. He WAS hired by the Stones (not necessarily for his lead guitar work, but still). I've been pretty impressed seeing him playing the guitar at Brian's shows the last couple of years.
8. And you would be wrong!
9. Again, in referring to No. 5 and 6, we really don't know the truths behind the Beach Boys and their families' relationships. I think it might be a lot worse than we know. It was probably very, very dysfunctional.
10. Eh...I definitely don't care for the "slow side" approach. THAT hurt the album. I will say that "In The Back Of My Mind" might be a little overrated. And don't get me started on "Bull Session With The Big Daddy". But with songs like "Please Let Me Wonder", "Kiss Me Baby", "She Knows Me Too Well', and even "I'm So Young" - that's some great stuff, some of the best pure, young Brian stuff that he ever wrote or recorded.
There, that wasn't too bad was it?
Note/Request: If any "staff" come on the board...whenever...could these posts/responses starting with my 10 Overrated BB-related Things post be put on a separate, new thread. You can name it Overrated Beach Boys or whatever you want to call it. I'd do it but I don't know how.
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Post by B.E. on Jul 27, 2019 15:09:09 GMT
Fightin' words on a few fronts! You're not kidding! Although, I can understand the argument for each item on SJS's list being overrated. That said, sometimes I'd rather just close my eyes. Okay, I'm not laughing anymore. Carry on...
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Jul 27, 2019 15:21:55 GMT
Fightin' words on a few fronts! You're not kidding! Although, I can understand the argument for each item on SJS's list being overrated. That said, sometimes I'd rather just close my eyes. Go ahead, make my day!
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Post by Kapitan on Jul 27, 2019 22:50:09 GMT
I should reply to a few replies. Rereply, if you will.
Dennis - I'm not saying it didn't help fill out albums, or that it was bad. Keep in mind, we're talking what we think is overrated. I think some of his songs are good. A lot are fine. Some are agonizing. But the idea that everything he did was just pure gold, well ... no.
Psychedelic/avant garde Brian - my point exactly. It was a short phase--at a time in which everyone and his dog was exploring the same territory. Overwhelmingly Brian was the exact opposite, working within very square or mainstream traditions. He was often brilliant within them, twisting and turning here and there to make great work. But his work almost never even touched on those areas.
Magic of family - what I really meant was more the fan community's constant dreaming of a second-generation version of the band, or how great it would be if so-and-so were replaced with some family member, or how, however good a modern song or recreation of an old song is, it is inferior because of some alleged family magic (when sometimes the originals weren't good, much less great). That line of thinking is nostalgia, not listening.
Today Side Two - don't misunderstand me, again, we're taking about overrated (not about being bad). As I see it, there are three great songs and three not-great songs. That's not even as good a percentage as side one, in my opinion.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Jul 28, 2019 0:32:59 GMT
I should reply to a few replies. Rereply, if you will.
Magic of family - what I really meant was more the fan community's constant dreaming of a second-generation version of the band, or how great it would be if so-and-so were replaced with some family member, or how, however good a modern song or recreation of an old song is, it is inferior because of some alleged family magic (when sometimes the originals weren't good, much less great). That line of thinking is nostalgia, not listening.
Yes, I misunderstood your point.
I have to say that I am probably, to some extent, one of those people you are referring to, as far as dreaming is concerned. I do believe, again to some extent, that an individual CAN pass a certain gene down to their offspring, one that affects the voice/vocal chords or whatever physically it takes to sing well - and I emphasize the word "can". I also believe that a son or daughter can pick up "certain things" in the way of musicianship, singing, and performing by being raised, being mentored, or just hanging out with a musical parent. Of course it's not a slam dunk or a probability, but I think it happens.
In the case of The Beach Boys, yes, I was or am one of those who wishes the BB "family" would form a band after their parents move on or pass on. I very much would like to hear what a group comprised of Carnie Wilson, Christian Love, Matt Jardine, Ambha Love, and any musical sons/daughters of Carl and Dennis could come up with. Just the fact they they are directly related to The Beach Boys makes it more intriguing and emotional. And they're talented, too, aren't they? I mean, you'd have to fill in some gaps with other musicians. Carnie's husband? I would prefer that configuration to just any old tribute band made up of a bunch of people I never heard of or had no emotional attachment to.
Specifically with a BB family mix, it might be cool if they resembled kind of a Mama & Papas sound, or Spring meets The Beach Boys. Maybe that's what Al was going for with his Family & Friends short-lived group.
Does this mean I disagree with you?
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Post by kds on Jul 28, 2019 3:52:41 GMT
Top 10 BB Related Overrated Things (In most cases, this doesn't mean I don't like it)
1. The Anti Mike Love Narrative
2. Love You
3. Pacific Ocean Blue
4. Smile
5. Brian Wilson Reimagines Gershwin
6. Smiley Smile
7. The Paley Sessions
8. A Day in the Life of a Tree
9. Cool Cool Water
10. Love and Mercy (song)
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Post by Kapitan on Jul 28, 2019 12:26:44 GMT
I should reply to a few replies. Rereply, if you will.
Magic of family - what I really meant was more the fan community's constant dreaming of a second-generation version of the band, or how great it would be if so-and-so were replaced with some family member, or how, however good a modern song or recreation of an old song is, it is inferior because of some alleged family magic (when sometimes the originals weren't good, much less great). That line of thinking is nostalgia, not listening.
Yes, I misunderstood your point.
I have to say that I am probably, to some extent, one of those people you are referring to, as far as dreaming is concerned. I do believe, again to some extent, that an individual CAN pass a certain gene down to their offspring, one that affects the voice/vocal chords or whatever physically it takes to sing well - and I emphasize the word "can". I also believe that a son or daughter can pick up "certain things" in the way of musicianship, singing, and performing by being raised, being mentored, or just hanging out with a musical parent. Of course it's not a slam dunk or a probability, but I think it happens.
In the case of The Beach Boys, yes, I was or am one of those who wishes the BB "family" would form a band after their parents move on or pass on. I very much would like to hear what a group comprised of Carnie Wilson, Christian Love, Matt Jardine, Ambha Love, and any musical sons/daughters of Carl and Dennis could come up with. Just the fact they they are directly related to The Beach Boys makes it more intriguing and emotional. And they're talented, too, aren't they? I mean, you'd have to fill in some gaps with other musicians. Carnie's husband? I would prefer that configuration to just any old tribute band made up of a bunch of people I never heard of or had no emotional attachment to.
Specifically with a BB family mix, it might be cool if they resembled kind of a Mama & Papas sound, or Spring meets The Beach Boys. Maybe that's what Al was going for with his Family & Friends short-lived group.
Does this mean I disagree with you? Absolutely genetics matter. Musical ability seems partly heritable, and obviously some family members do sound similar or share taste, etc.
As for the rest, it's fine if you'd prefer a family-based group. Whether we disagree depends on the degree to which you acknowledge it being a sentimental thing as opposed to insisting it's some necessity for quality. Again, the "magic" of a--or that--family. If you were going to insist no other collection of people could sound as good, then we disagree. If you just would enjoy seeing the clan get together more, then that's no problem for me. (I actually still disagree, but don't mind.)
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