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Post by lonelysummer on Aug 22, 2023 3:14:01 GMT
Just a few random articles I found in Billboard from the 80's. Attachments:
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Post by lonelysummer on Aug 22, 2023 3:14:50 GMT
January 1984 Attachments:
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Post by lonelysummer on Aug 22, 2023 3:15:34 GMT
Interesting to see they were still drawing well as a live band. Attachments:
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Aug 22, 2023 10:47:52 GMT
Just a few random articles I found in Billboard from the 80's. I bought that Rock 'n' Roll City cassette and actually still have it! I don't have many BB cassettes. It was an interesting comp, not necessarily...good, but interesting. Obviously "California Dreamin'" got the most plays.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Aug 22, 2023 10:52:33 GMT
The band really cleaned up their act - personally and professionally - after Dennis's death. Actually, they started a year or so earlier when Carl made his "statement" and Brian re-entered treatment with Dr. Landy. If anything, they looked healthier. I was expecting big things. There were no more excuses or barriers. Unfortunately it never happened, at least album-wise.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Aug 22, 2023 10:59:49 GMT
Interesting to see they were still drawing well as a live band. No matter when the era, the condition of the country, the trends in music, or the makeup of the touring band - people will come out to hear that music! Next month I'm going to see...The Beach Boys ...and other than Mike and Bruce, I don't even know who these guys are. It's probably, no, definitely, the least emotional attachment I've ever had to the (touring) band.
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Post by Kapitan on Aug 22, 2023 13:26:53 GMT
The band really cleaned up their act - personally and professionally - after Dennis's death. Actually, they started a year or so earlier when Carl made his "statement" and Brian re-entered treatment with Dr. Landy. If anything, they looked healthier. I was expecting big things. There were no more excuses or barriers. Unfortunately it never happened, at least album-wise. To me, this would have been a perfect time to revisit something more like a Guercio approach, with truly well recorded, real instruments up at Caribou (or wherever). A serious band effort without chasing the shiny new thing that was Levine's sound. I really think the mid-80s were a great time for a mature, solid Beach Boys effort. I don't think they achieved that on record. Not really.
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Post by lonelysummer on Aug 22, 2023 19:04:51 GMT
Just a few random articles I found in Billboard from the 80's. I bought that Rock 'n' Roll City cassette and actually still have it! I don't have many BB cassettes. It was an interesting comp, not necessarily...good, but interesting. Obviously "California Dreamin'" got the most plays. I have the vinyl version, and California Dreamin' isn't on it. The album is retitled "Rock and Roll Again". Different artwork, too. They did the same with "Paul Revere Rides Again". The vinyl is all Raiders, but the cassette includes tracks from Blood Sweat and Tears, Eric Burdon, and Mary McGregor.
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Post by lonelysummer on Aug 22, 2023 19:06:27 GMT
Interesting to see they were still drawing well as a live band. No matter when the era, the condition of the country, the trends in music, or the makeup of the touring band - people will come out to hear that music! Next month I'm going to see...The Beach Boys ...and other than Mike and Bruce, I don't even know who these guys are. It's probably, no, definitely, the least emotional attachment I've ever had to the (touring) band. Yeah, I feel the same way. Going to see them this weekend. Local people are raving about the new drummer, but I don't know anything about him. I'm sure it will be a good show, but I'm going to miss Scott and John.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Aug 22, 2023 19:35:37 GMT
The band really cleaned up their act - personally and professionally - after Dennis's death. Actually, they started a year or so earlier when Carl made his "statement" and Brian re-entered treatment with Dr. Landy. If anything, they looked healthier. I was expecting big things. There were no more excuses or barriers. Unfortunately it never happened, at least album-wise. To me, this would have been a perfect time to revisit something more like a Guercio approach, with truly well recorded, real instruments up at Caribou (or wherever). A serious band effort without chasing the shiny new thing that was Levine's sound. I really think the mid-80s were a great time for a mature, solid Beach Boys effort. I don't think they achieved that on record. Not really. I agree. It hasn't really hit the history books or any serious re-evaluation of the group's history...yet...but I think you have to take a serious look at the group's choices of producer(s) after Holland. Yes, it is mentioned in the respective album reviews, and we fans can get into it pretty good with our discussions, but isn't it almost unanimous that poor production played a major part in the band's lack of critical (and maybe commercial) success post-1973. Of course there are several other reasons and they are addressed, too, but without a good/the right producer, it almost doesn't matter what you come up with. The music will not reach its potential...or certain audiences. If a poll was taken by knowledgeable people/fans regarding the lack of success by The Beach Boys post-Holland, I'm curious where "wrong producer" would fall.
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Post by lonelysummer on Aug 23, 2023 4:29:29 GMT
I can't fault the choice of Steve Levine. It had been 5 years since the last BB's album, and pop music had changed a lot in that time. I see BB85 as a fairly mature sounding Beach Boys record, which is mostly Carl's influence. Only a couple songs really try to recapture the feeling of those 1963-65 hits. Yes, they could have recorded an album with all natural instruments, and the hardcore fans might have loved it, but it would have stiffed commercially. Look at what was on the radio at that time - it was all drum machines and synths. So you have to decide as a recording artist, whether you want to try to compete with the big boys (Phil Collins, Genesis, Mike and the Mechanics, more Phil Collins, Philip Bailey, more Phil Collins), or aim for a more out-of-the-mainstream audience, and settle for sales strictly to the hardcore fans. Mike never was interested in making records that only sold to a small group of hardcore fans; he's always wanted to do things he believed had great commercial potential (he was convinced Summer in Paradise was gonna be a blockbuster because it stuck to his formula of sun, surf, sand and girls). Carl seemed to embrace the new technology whole heartedly. IMO, where they really blew it was not following up BB85 with another studio album. Made it USA was a good 25th anniversary comp, but by 87 or 88 they should have had an all new album ready. But to prove how truly bleeped up they were in the late 80's, even a #1 single couldn't motivate them to get an all new album out. Instead, we got Still Cruisin'; and being the geniuses they are, they waited until all the momentum from Kokomo had dissipated to finally put out an all new album.
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Post by Kapitan on Aug 23, 2023 11:28:01 GMT
I see your point about Levine, lonelysummer, but I think it was a desperate and short-sighted decision. Chasing a very "of the times" trend inevitably means that music will be placed in time (and so quickly dated). Personally I think there is no dignity in bands and artists of the Beach Boys' stature so fully and blatantly doing it. Yes, other artists at the time did it, too--and I think it was their big mistake, too! Paul McCartney never had an album as bad as Press to Play, and while relatively weak songs were part of it, the production was a big part of it as well. To me, legacy artists in particular almost uniformly looked stupid in the 80s trying to sound like the new kids on the block (no pun intended). For every success (Phil Collins), there was a Macca, Lou Reed, Bob Dylan, and yes, the Beach Boys just looking and sounding dumb. The kind of album I was saying I'd have preferred would have aged far better. It's only in the past decade or so, as 80s sounds became fashionable again, that I began hearing many Beach Boys fans start saying they like 85. At best before that, it was "it might be OK if not for the drum machines and synths," etc. I think a more organic production could have been a slower burn, maybe less immediately of the times but more a fit in any time. But of course it's just my opinion.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Aug 25, 2023 11:24:17 GMT
I can't fault the choice of Steve Levine. It had been 5 years since the last BB's album, and pop music had changed a lot in that time. I see BB85 as a fairly mature sounding Beach Boys record, which is mostly Carl's influence. Only a couple songs really try to recapture the feeling of those 1963-65 hits. Yes, they could have recorded an album with all natural instruments, and the hardcore fans might have loved it, but it would have stiffed commercially. I will say this in defense of Steve Levine. I think Brian's songs are some of the weakest he ever contributed to a Beach Boys' album. To me, they lack that BW magic or special feeling that was usually present and were the highlights of most BB albums, including the later-period ones. Also, even though Mike Love sang lead on "the hit", he's mostly absent on the album, ironically called The Beach Boys.
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Emdeeh
Pacific Coast Highway
Posts: 520
Likes: 532
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Post by Emdeeh on Aug 25, 2023 13:35:54 GMT
Part of the BBs' problem with recording in the '80s and beyond was that they had to have Brian included to get an album deal. And that meant dealing with Landy. Note that their one Brianless album, SIP, was self-released. They had better luck getting deals for singles on soundtracks in that era.
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Post by lonelysummer on Aug 26, 2023 0:45:03 GMT
I can't fault the choice of Steve Levine. It had been 5 years since the last BB's album, and pop music had changed a lot in that time. I see BB85 as a fairly mature sounding Beach Boys record, which is mostly Carl's influence. Only a couple songs really try to recapture the feeling of those 1963-65 hits. Yes, they could have recorded an album with all natural instruments, and the hardcore fans might have loved it, but it would have stiffed commercially. I will say this in defense of Steve Levine. I think Brian's songs are some of the weakest he ever contributed to a Beach Boys' album. To me, they lack that BW magic or special feeling that was usually present and were the highlights of most BB albums, including the later-period ones. Also, even though Mike Love sang lead on "the hit", he's mostly absent on the album, ironically called The Beach Boys. I think Brian (aka Landy) was saving his best material for his solo album. Brian's songs on the 85 album are average at best. The album could have been a lot better if he had tunes like Melt Away or Love and Mercy to share with the boys. Yeah, it's odd that Mike only has one real lead vocal on the whole album. He shares California Calling with Al, and it's Just a Matter of Time with Brian. I've gotten the impression that Mike was not fond of Levine's production; as soon as Terry Melcher took over as producer of the group, it was all about Mike. BB85 was really Carl's baby.
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