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Post by beachboystalkmatt on May 14, 2023 0:33:03 GMT
Hello friends, I hope you’ll join us this Tuesday as we review The Beach Boys 1978 album MIU with Giggens! It’s one of my favorites. Join us live Tuesday night at 8 EST as we review every song. Greg will play them live.
What are your thoughts on the MIU album?
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Post by lonelysummer on May 14, 2023 1:13:26 GMT
I think this album was rock bottom until Summer in Paradise.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on May 14, 2023 11:10:02 GMT
Thoughts on M.I.U. Album?
- I like it more than probably most fans.
- I am still intrigued/pleased/shocked(?) at how well Brian's voice recovered in such a short period of time (from Love You). It wasn't just that he sounded less hoarse and raspy, but he sang more relaxed. It would be many years before we heard that voice again. I also like his lead vocal on "She's Got Rhythm". I don't think it is shrill or overly-forced.
- I felt The Beach Boys were comfortable singing the type of songs and subject matter on M.I.U. Album. It seemed like a good fit.
- My biggest problem with M.I.U. Album is the amount of music or number of songs. The group went from 15 songs on 15 Big Ones to 14 songs on Love You to just 12 songs on M.I.U Album. I think it is noticeable. The addition of "Our Team", "Winter Symphony", and/or a finished "Mike Come Back To L.A." - and better sequencing - would've improved the album, in my opinion, by almost a full grade.
- "Match Point Of Our Love" is an underrated song - and the lyrics are fine!
- It is disappointing that Dennis (and somewhat Carl) chose to not participate in the album. It was even more disappointing that Dennis chose to criticize the album in the press. If he had such a problem with M.I.U. Album, then maybe he could've participated more and made it better. In the past, The Beach Boys made room for a song or two or three of his. Why would they not with M.I.U. Album? Same with Carl.
- I've always wondered (and still struggle with) just how much Brian Wilson contributed to the songwriting on the songs he is credited with, the arrangements, and the production. Ron Altbach was such a presence at that time; it's hard to ignore that. The segments in the Our Team documentary show a Brian Wilson that is very involved, but I'm sure they are edited, too. There is still so little written or spoken about the M.I.U. Album sessions, yet there appeared to be so many people - a team - present.
- Speaking of the Our Team documentary, it would be nice if that could be officially released in some fashion. I wonder if the master tape still exists?
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Post by Kapitan on May 14, 2023 11:32:20 GMT
I think it's a mediocre album, and (if I were a betting man, I'd say) an example of pretending Brian was really involved much more than he was. But I also think his voice is mostly pretty good--although I'd love to hear the "She's Got Rhythm" Sheriff John Stone hears, because it's not the one I hear--despite less-than-great material for the most part. It's mostly listenable, though. That's something.
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Post by carllove on May 15, 2023 18:07:14 GMT
Giggens is awesome. I follow him on Youtube and Facebook. M.I.U. not so much.
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Post by lonelysummer on May 16, 2023 3:40:05 GMT
We sure seem to discuss MIU a lot here.
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Post by Kapitan on May 16, 2023 12:33:53 GMT
We sure seem to discuss MIU a lot here. Well in this case, it's because our friends at Beach Boys Talk were doing a show about it. And to be fair, when there is a limited catalog, we're always recycling the albums: rate the albums; best and worst song off each album; singles (off each album); album covers ... the same albums are going to come up again. Besides, how many times can you say "Yes, I, too, think Pet Sounds is a great album"? But really, compared to how good an album it is, yes, it gets disproportionate attention. But I think that's because it's an important moment, with Brian Wilson (despite credits to the contrary) again reduced to a background role, and the rise of Mike Love and Al Jardine for the time being, more prominent outside collaborators (which never really stopped happening), the clear factionalism that never went away, the trip to Iowa to record ... it's an interesting time, if a pretty poor album.
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Post by carllove on May 16, 2023 16:35:47 GMT
We sure seem to discuss MIU a lot here. Well in this case, it's because our friends at Beach Boys Talk were doing a show about it. And to be fair, when there is a limited catalog, we're always recycling the albums: rate the albums; best and worst song off each album; singles (off each album); album covers ... the same albums are going to come up again. Besides, how many times can you say "Yes, I, too, think Pet Sounds is a great album"? But really, compared to how good an album it is, yes, it gets disproportionate attention. But I think that's because it's an important moment, with Brian Wilson (despite credits to the contrary) again reduced to a background role, and the rise of Mike Love and Al Jardine for the time being, more prominent outside collaborators (which never really stopped happening), the clear factionalism that never went away, the trip to Iowa to record ... it's an interesting time, if a pretty poor album. Released one year later, L.A. is so much a better album IMHO. Of course it has some great songs from Dennis and the Disco "Here Comes The Night" which I adore, even if no one else does. What changed in that short time frame? I'm really not that familiar with the 1978-1979 Beach Boys dynamics.
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Post by Kapitan on May 16, 2023 17:38:57 GMT
I'd replied but got the proboards error message when I submitted the reply, so it's lost.
But in short, I think it's interesting that they went from an Altbach-helmed Love-and-Jardine album with virtually no Dennis or Carl to a much slicker, Johnston-and-Guercio helmed album that features more or less solo music from Dennis and Carl, but almost no Love or Jardine. However, I think that the band after Holland is best understood as throwing shit at the wall and seeing what sticks. Every album is a pretty significant change from the one before it right up through Still Cruisin. Who is engaged in making new music, who is producing, who has the internal band political control, what are the trends, which way is the wind blowing...
Maybe the best reason for the dramatic change was, "well, MIU didn't hit, so let's try it this way."
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Post by carllove on May 16, 2023 19:51:17 GMT
I'd replied but got the proboards error message when I submitted the reply, so it's lost. But in short, I think it's interesting that they went from an Altbach-helmed Love-and-Jardine album with virtually no Dennis or Carl to a much slicker, Johnston-and-Guercio helmed album that features more or less solo music from Dennis and Carl, but almost no Love or Jardine. However, I think that the band after Holland is best understood as throwing shit at the wall and seeing what sticks. Every album is a pretty significant change from the one before it right up through Still Cruisin. Who is engaged in making new music, who is producing, who has the internal band political control, what are the trends, which way is the wind blowing... Maybe the best reason for the dramatic change was, "well, MIU didn't hit, so let's try it this way." The board has been acting really weird today. I kept getting errors on login. Sounds like a great explanation Kapitan. Also makes sense as to why I like L.A. so much more than M.I.U.- since I'm a big fan of both Dennis and Carl.
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Post by jk on May 18, 2023 13:58:00 GMT
I gave up on the show (sorry, guys) and instead gave said album a couple of spins over the past two days. It's one I wasn't at all familiar with thanks to the drubbing it generally gets but I discovered I actually like it -- a lot. It's nostalgia all the way but there's nothing wrong with that! So thanks Matt, Gregg and Giggens for pointing me at it!
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Post by beachboystalkmatt on May 18, 2023 14:22:46 GMT
I gave up on the show (sorry, guys) and instead gave said album a couple of spins over the past two days. It's one I wasn't at all familiar with thanks to the drubbing it generally gets but I discovered I actually like it -- a lot. It's nostalgia all the way but there's nothing wrong with that! So thanks Matt, Gregg and Giggens for pointing me at it! Thanks for watching! Not sure when you stopped, but Gary Griffin comes in a bit later on in the show to talk about the making of the album. He told some great stories! I’m so glad to hear you like the album. Not everything has to be Pet Sounds!
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Post by jk on May 18, 2023 15:52:16 GMT
I gave up on the show (sorry, guys) and instead gave said album a couple of spins over the past two days. It's one I wasn't at all familiar with thanks to the drubbing it generally gets but I discovered I actually like it -- a lot. It's nostalgia all the way but there's nothing wrong with that! So thanks Matt, Gregg and Giggens for pointing me at it! Thanks for watching! Not sure when you stopped, but Gary Griffin comes in a bit later on in the show to talk about the making of the album. He told some great stories! I’m so glad to hear you like the album. Not everything has to be Pet Sounds! Really? Yes, I stopped before then. I'll definitely check out that part -- thanks, Matt. Sorry for giving Greg an extra g!
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Post by Kapitan on May 18, 2023 15:53:07 GMT
I'm listening to the part with Griffin now. Fascinating. I'll comment once I'm through it.
I just heard something I didn't realize: not only were they doing the MIU and Christmas versions of tunes at MIU, but they also recorded some of the Celebration material and some of Charles Lloyd's Weavings.
The discussion about who really was producing was also not shocking, but good to hear: basically it was Mike's, Ron's and Al's project, with all the musicians contributing to arrangements and ideas, and then whenever Brian had something to contribute, they dropped their approaches and used his suggestions. But I think that does help shed light on the question of how involved Brian was, did Brian really "produce" in a traditional way? (The answer is no.)
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Post by Kapitan on May 18, 2023 18:20:48 GMT
The discussion about who really was producing was also not shocking, but good to hear: basically it was Mike's, Ron's and Al's project, with all the musicians contributing to arrangements and ideas, and then whenever Brian had something to contribute, they dropped their approaches and used his suggestions. But I think that does help shed light on the question of how involved Brian was, did Brian really "produce" in a traditional way? (The answer is no.) Interestingly, if I understood his take on it, beachboystalkmatt and I had almost the polar opposite takeaway in terms of how involved Griffin said Brian was. Matt said something (after GG left) about how it was good to get confirmed whether Brian was very involved, and that it was a "yes," using the statements about Brian showing them chord progressions without the rest of the song as being "just like the old days." I took that very differently! To me, it sounded more likely that they weren't really songs with a complete vision (and certainly at least not one being shared), but skeletons of songs that were worked out later. We know of them using that same process at times on KTSA material, where something that began as an oldie became one of the new Wilson/Love tunes. (I forget the tunes in question.) That yes, Brian was there, and yes, he contributed, but he definitely wasn't the man or heavily calling the shots. Just that when he had something, anything, they took it. And otherwise they went about it under the Mike/Al/Ron A team's direction (and with people like Gary and Ed contributing their own parts).
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