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Post by B.E. on May 26, 2023 23:15:24 GMT
I do. But not in any more detail than you just described. Might have been posted to some social media or something? But I recall it similarly: just him at a piano for a few seconds. Yes, I remember it. It was about 10-15 seconds long and people went nuts over it. What year would you say that was? Do you recall?
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on May 26, 2023 23:22:34 GMT
Yes, I remember it. It was about 10-15 seconds long and people went nuts over it. What year would you say that was? Do you recall? I'm sorry I do not recall the year. Was it around the time they started the documentary?
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Post by B.E. on May 26, 2023 23:25:12 GMT
I don't think so, I think it was much earlier. Edit: Sheriff John Stone , Kapitan , it was 2008. It was part of a Rolling Stone interview during the TLOS tour.
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Post by Kapitan on May 27, 2023 13:51:33 GMT
They could've edited out all "Long Promised Road" references in the film - if Brian wasn't gonna perform it in studio footage or on the soundtrack - and had Larry Fine ask him about other soundtrack songs. "Hey, Brian, tell me about that song, "Where I Belong". Is that a reference to you?" Or, "It's Not Easy Being Me". Is that about your life, Brian? Is that what inspired that song?" And then Brian would say, "Yeah." You've lost me somewhat with your point. Sure, they could have edited out all the "Long Promised Road" references in the film, and then it wouldn't have made sense to call the film that or include the recording of it. Then they could have changed the film to include something else, which you then could call the film and include in the recordings. But why? It seems like that's just a strange and obviously after-the-fact alternate history to make your criticism of the film we do have, with the (relevant) title and song inclusion become more obvious or valid. But by that logic, you could also rework the film by recording Brian talking about the Beatles, and have him record Beatles songs, and call it "Brian and the Beatles." I mean, sure, if that were what happened, that would make sense. But what did happen is what we're talking about, so LPR as title and being on the soundtrack makes sense. I grant that I might just be really dense this morning and be missing things entirely.
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Post by Kapitan on May 27, 2023 14:04:02 GMT
OK, here are my picks. But first, when I relistened to this last night, I was startled again at how badly Brian sings on the "new" songs. (Sorry, the quotation marks are ironic, in that it took so long to get the damn movie out that they'd been in the can for years by this point. Celebrity couples woud have met, married, divorced, and remarried in that span.) I'm sorry, but he is terrible. "It's OK," is one example. He's kind-of yelling (while out of breath) the whole thing. Admittedly he's more or less on key (though definitely not consistently or firmly so), but that doesn't make good singing. "The Night Was So Young" is pretty rough, too, which is a shame in that a good '00s performance by Brian could have been great. Anyway...
Best: "In My Room" It almost doesn't seem fair to pick it, as a live song that features group harmony singing more than Brian's own, not to mention it's an all-time classic sitting among some decent and some pretty poor songs (and performances). If I had to go with something else, because of Brian's voice, I'd have to pick one of the archival releases, which is unfortunate in that none of those are particularly great songs. Probably "Must Be a Miracle" or "It's Not Easy Being Me." Of the newer recordings, probably "Rock and Roll Has Got a Hold On Me."
Worst: "It's OK" I really like this song, but Brian is just not good, and he's out front. But I don't several of these. As I said, the good songs aren't particularly well sung or produced, and the better produced or recorded and sung ones aren't especially good songs (and have been lying around for 30 years). I really hate some parts of the featured tune, the new "Right Where I Belong." Specifically, the part (and singing) that opens the song. It's really terrible. Other parts are really cliched and dull. But then there are some nice things, like the "Everybody's Talkin" vibe that kicks in later and some of Brian's singing in spots. The fact that this was the centerpiece and was so flawed bugs me a lot, but as I said, it still doesn't take the cake for worst. Maybe more "most frustrating," if we had such an award.
Not a great way to end a legendary career, assuming it does.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on May 27, 2023 14:17:32 GMT
They could've edited out all "Long Promised Road" references in the film - if Brian wasn't gonna perform it in studio footage or on the soundtrack - and had Larry Fine ask him about other soundtrack songs. "Hey, Brian, tell me about that song, "Where I Belong". Is that a reference to you?" Or, "It's Not Easy Being Me". Is that about your life, Brian? Is that what inspired that song?" And then Brian would say, "Yeah." You've lost me somewhat with your point. Sure, they could have edited out all the "Long Promised Road" references in the film, and then it wouldn't have made sense to call the film that or include the recording of it. Then they could have changed the film to include something else, which you then could call the film and include in the recordings.
But why? It seems like that's just a strange and obviously after-the-fact alternate history to make your criticism of the film we do have, with the (relevant) title and song inclusion become more obvious or valid. But by that logic, you could also rework the film by recording Brian talking about the Beatles, and have him record Beatles songs, and call it "Brian and the Beatles." I mean, sure, if that were what happened, that would make sense. But what did happen is what we're talking about, so LPR as title and being on the soundtrack makes sense. I grant that I might just be really dense this morning and be missing things entirely. You "got" my point in the first paragraph of your above post. I'll admit to nit-picking again. I guess I was just getting tired of trying to associate Brian with things that he didn't really have much of a connection with - just to get attention or get a reaction. The Gershwins (I know that's gonna get me in trouble), Disney movies/music, and now this random Beach Boys' (Carl Wilson!) song. OK, Brian likes the song, but did they have to take that big extra step and try to weave it into the documentary? It doesn't resonate with me. And I'll repeat, if it was so important to him, then why didn't he sing it in the studio for the documentary - or - perform it in concert or on the soundtrack? Blondie Chaplin handles it in both cases. That makes no sense to me. And, I'll also say again. It's A Carl friggin' Wilson song, not a Brian Wilson song, and this is a Brian Wilson documentary! Such a strange artistic choice.
Back to your points. Yes, I would've reworked (in the first place) the film and had Brian talk about HIS songs, including some of the personal songs that were featured on the soundtrack, or some of Brian's other, older songs that we know/think/might be surprised were important to him. That's what I thought the documentary was going to feature more. Yes, there is some of that icluding "Long Promised Road", but I thought there would be more. Maybe even a rapid-fire, one-word answer type of thing, covering many more songs, even the more obscure ones. There's so many. A missed opportunity.
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Post by Kapitan on May 27, 2023 14:24:37 GMT
The whole reworking thing just makes no sense to me. I guess I get what you are saying now, I just think it's ... well, I will leave it alone.
As for the question, though: why didn't Brian sing "Long Promised Road"? That's pretty easy: his singing is really bad on this album. It's a wordy song that he'd fumble with terribly. He could not sing it remotely well. Both Blondie Chaplin and Jim James can still sing. So pull a "Sloop John B" or "Surfer Girl" and have Brian chip in his cameo.
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Post by B.E. on May 27, 2023 18:13:22 GMT
As for the question, though: why didn't Brian sing "Long Promised Road"? That's pretty easy: his singing is really bad on this album. It's a wordy song that he'd fumble with terribly. He could not sing it remotely well. Both Blondie Chaplin and Jim James can still sing. So pull a "Sloop John B" or "Surfer Girl" and have Brian chip in his cameo.Ah, OK, I was starting to question my recollections of the album. I could have sworn Brian sung on "Long Promised Road". And he did. He's one of the three co-leads. I remember thinking that I actually preferred his singing on the song to Blondie's and Jim's. I'll have more to say, but I'd like to give a fresh listen to the album first and ponder my picks for best and worst.
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Post by B.E. on May 27, 2023 23:45:56 GMT
Best - "Must Be A Miracle" - Like I alluded to in my post below, some of these Paley tracks are something of a revelation for me. I'm not really into bootlegs, and so while I have heard that material, I haven't listened to it extensively. And the sound quality here is so much better. Next up is the very fine performance of "In My Room", "I'm Goin' Home", and the punk "I'm Broke". On the latter, I understand people being put-off by his vocal, but I really dig the punk attitude. And - yes, thankfully - it is a one-off performance. (In other words, would I want him to sing a whole album like that? Hell no!) Worst - "The Night Was So Young" - The only bad track on the album, IMO. Brian's vocal - well, actually, the vocal production thereof - being the main culprit. I'm going to quote my review from the album thread here. (It doesn't have any 'likes' so it must not have been read by anyone. ) At first, I was a little worried that I might have been too generous, but it withstood my listen today. I stand by it. I like this soundtrack. I've already listened to it more than I thought I would (at least a half dozen times in full). The new tracks are decent-to-good. I like pretty much everything about "Right Where I Belong" except that unseemly vocal moment in the intro section on "is". Later in the song, that part sounds a little better, so I'm thinking it was a production issue that made a bad vocal take much worse. Anyway, I really like the song itself, including the lyrics and the "Don't Go Near The Water" reference, the arrangement, and the falsetto vocal. And, frankly, I even like Brian's lead, for the most part. And that's true of most of Brian's leads on the new tracks. While entirely imperfect, I get a kick out of Brian's lead on "It's OK". He's into it. "Rock and Roll Has Got A Hold On Me" is pretty darn good. He's not slurring or out-of-key (to my ears), but it does sound like he might struggle with breath support/technique. What I like about the vocal production is that these are pretty natural-sounding leads. They sound mostly single-tracked and unfutzed with (either by excessive reverb, EQ, or autotune). I appreciate that, and they fit with the relatively pared-down backing tracks. "Honeycomb" mostly fits in that same category, but here Brian's enunciation is more of an issue. Then there's "The Night Was So Young" which is flat-out BAD. It's marred by autotune. This is easily my least favorite track on the album. As for "Long Promised Road", I think I might actually like Brian's lead best of the bunch! (I have mixed feelings about the track overall - it's OK, but not a highlight for me.) Having high quality versions of the Paley material is great. Tracks that I had been lukewarm on, I like much more now (e.g. "It's Not Easy Being Me" and "Slightly American Music"). I'm no audiophile, but I still find the difference between the average bootleg and a proper release night and day. "I'm Going Home" is new to me. I really like it. Nice arrangement touches and a pretty good vocal for the Paley era. I just dig it. It's fun. And it reminds of "Rio Grande". As does "Slightly American Music", but in an entirely different way. That one hadn't really left much of an impression on me before, but now I'm very impressed with it! And, I don't know what they did to "I'm Broke", maybe they just tucked that vocal into the mix perfectly, but now I can enjoy it without reservation. As for "Must Be A Miracle", I've always been a big fan of that one. The circa '99 vocal is an improvement. This might be one of his best post-60s songs! Then there's the live version of "In My Room". As I posted earlier in the thread, I think Brian sounds great on it. I can't explain exactly why, but I think the pairing of the Paley era with these new recordings circa 2016, and also the featuring of both in the documentary, just works much better than you'd think. I think there's some similarities between the two eras - which provides continuity. For one thing, Brian is struggling. He's certainly struggling vocally. These are arguably Brian's two weakest periods as a singer. The sequencing, though, is VERY good. I think that helps the listening experience. And the approach to give a live-in-the-studio feel throughout works very well and I think is very appropriate of these recordings. These are unfinished and imperfect projects. But, there's plenty here to like and enjoy, I think. At least, there is for me. It's freeing, in a way, that this isn't a "proper" studio album but a soundtrack or compilation. You can leave the expectations and comparisons at the door and just enjoy the fact that there's some new (and some not-so-new-but-better-sounding-than-ever) Brian Wilson music to hear.
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Post by B.E. on May 28, 2023 23:59:13 GMT
I think it's certainly among the low points of the Brian Wilson solo catalogue. Maybe the low point. While relistening for this thread, I finally went through my proper routine of rating and ranking the songs and ultimately adding the album to my master Beach Boys-related album ranking. With that newfound perspective, and with some time having passed since the initial release, I'm confident in saying that I don't consider it a/the low point of Brian's solo catalogue. Furthermore, I certainly don't consider it a low point or embarrassment on the level of other Beach Boys related projects. For Brian's solo career, I rank this above I Just Wasn't Made For These Times, Orange Crate Art, and (narrowly) Gettin' In Over My Head. I also rank it above a few Beach Boys albums, such as, Summer in Paradise, Stars & Stripes, and (as an album) Still Cruisin'. I'll also take it over the entirety of Mike's (and Bruce's) solo catalogues. In total, I've got it ranked above 15 other albums. (Of course, I've got it ranked below many more than that, but having finally ranked the album I just wanted to share that.) Ultimately, I rate it a (low) 6. Just below the likes of MIU, Gershwin, Disney, Imagination, and Blondie's debut.
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Post by B.E. on May 29, 2023 13:42:09 GMT
Lastly, I just want to say that I like the title of the documentary and soundtrack. I think it's fitting and touching in numerous ways. I like learning that a Carl song means a lot to Brian. As we all know, Brian has trouble expressing himself and dealing with death. He also, as far as I can gather, has had little to say about his brothers' music, his bandmates', or darn near anyone not named Phil Spector. His interest has predominantly been in his (Brian's) music and his brothers and bandmates bringing it to life. But that doesn't mean that Brian doesn't care at all or can't feel a connection to their music, but I think it just speaks to how his mind works and where he was mentally and where their relationships were when his brothers and bandmates were making their own music. The early-mid 70s and early 80s were not a good time for Brian. He was having a hard enough time taking care of himself. And the 2nd Landy era hardly fostered positive relationships with his brothers and bandmates. I'm reminded of a 2015 quote from Brian in Dreamer: The Making of Dennis Wilson's Pacific Ocean Blue where Brian said, "I never got the chance to compliment Dennis and tell him how much I loved his work; I don't know why, but I never got the chance to tell him."
I finally was able to find that clip of Brian performing "Long Promised Road" on the piano. It's not the performance that's meaningful, it's his praise of it afterward and the fact that Jeff Foskett - someone who knew Brian as well as anyone - was clearly moved that Brian had played it. Here it is, from December 2008:
Brian also mentioned it in his 2016 autobiography saying, "I didn’t write “Long Promised Road.” Carl did, with Jack Rieley, for Surf's Up. It was the first song Carl really wrote for the band, and I loved the message of it. We put it out as a single and “’Til I Die” was on the B-side. The song was about the kinds of things that Carl was feeling, and they were also the things that I felt all the time. It was hard to feel happy and light when there were sad things in my head. It was hard to feel free when I was tied down. But the only choice was to try." I think it's touching that Brian was going to a Carl song, over and over, to find comfort in the Long Promised Road documentary. And I also just think it's cool that they'd feature/promote a Carl song. That some fans thought it was an odd choice at first, I completely get that. But it comes together. It makes sense. It's meaningful. (And it also makes sense that Blondie would be featured in the recording and in concert considering he was in the group, on stage, performing the song in the early/mid 70s.) I like that it's not an obvious choice or what you'd expect.
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Post by Kapitan on May 29, 2023 13:49:43 GMT
I agree with all of that ^.
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Post by kds on May 30, 2023 12:44:38 GMT
OK, here are my picks. But first, when I relistened to this last night, I was startled again at how badly Brian sings on the "new" songs. (Sorry, the quotation marks are ironic, in that it took so long to get the damn movie out that they'd been in the can for years by this point. Celebrity couples woud have met, married, divorced, and remarried in that span.) I'm sorry, but he is terrible. "It's OK," is one example. He's kind-of yelling (while out of breath) the whole thing. Admittedly he's more or less on key (though definitely not consistently or firmly so), but that doesn't make good singing. "The Night Was So Young" is pretty rough, too, which is a shame in that a good '00s performance by Brian could have been great. Anyway... Best: "In My Room" It almost doesn't seem fair to pick it, as a live song that features group harmony singing more than Brian's own, not to mention it's an all-time classic sitting among some decent and some pretty poor songs (and performances). If I had to go with something else, because of Brian's voice, I'd have to pick one of the archival releases, which is unfortunate in that none of those are particularly great songs. Probably "Must Be a Miracle" or "It's Not Easy Being Me." Of the newer recordings, probably "Rock and Roll Has Got a Hold On Me." Worst: "It's OK" I really like this song, but Brian is just not good, and he's out front. But I don't several of these. As I said, the good songs aren't particularly well sung or produced, and the better produced or recorded and sung ones aren't especially good songs (and have been lying around for 30 years). I really hate some parts of the featured tune, the new "Right Where I Belong." Specifically, the part (and singing) that opens the song. It's really terrible. Other parts are really cliched and dull. But then there are some nice things, like the "Everybody's Talkin" vibe that kicks in later and some of Brian's singing in spots. The fact that this was the centerpiece and was so flawed bugs me a lot, but as I said, it still doesn't take the cake for worst. Maybe more "most frustrating," if we had such an award. Not a great way to end a legendary career, assuming it does.I tend to view both LPR and At My Piano more as footnotes than true endings. Sure, it's a (likely) finale in a technical sense, but it feels more like a compilation to me.
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Post by Kapitan on May 30, 2023 12:57:05 GMT
I agree with you, kds. Especially LPR doesn't feel like a real finale so much as an add-on. What, half of the songs are 25 years old? And the rest (except one) are obviously hastily done remakes? It doesn't scream "album" in a traditional sense. At My Piano is along the same lines, but I think it had more care put into it. But even that almost felt like a way to hide that Brian couldn't sing (well) on a new album anymore. Honestly I look at NPP as the actual finale. With "The Last Song" and the obvious attention he put into it, sometimes I think Brian thought of it that way, too. But then again, it seems like TWGMTR was thought of that way as well (although on that front, it almost certainly will turn out to be the last Beach Boys studio album...even if they waffled on it for a while).
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Post by kds on May 30, 2023 13:02:55 GMT
I agree with you, kds . Especially LPR doesn't feel like a real finale so much as an add-on. What, half of the songs are 25 years old? And the rest (except one) are obviously hastily done remakes? It doesn't scream "album" in a traditional sense. At My Piano is along the same lines, but I think it had more care put into it. But even that almost felt like a way to hide that Brian couldn't sing (well) on a new album anymore. Honestly I look at NPP as the actual finale. With "The Last Song" and the obvious attention he put into it, sometimes I think Brian thought of it that way, too. But then again, it seems like TWGMTR was thought of that way as well (although on that front, it almost certainly will turn out to be the last Beach Boys studio album...even if they waffled on it for a while). I agree about both NPP and TWGMTR. I remember either Brian or Joe said that Summer's Gone was written with the intention of it being the final Beach Boys song. Although, my foggy memory recalls one of them saying something similar about The Last Song, when there was talk that some of the newer NPP material was written with the mindset that there could be a follow up to TWGMTR.
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