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Post by Kapitan on Jul 6, 2020 18:38:52 GMT
For some reason, SJS's post about the death of Charlie Daniels got me thinking about how we often grieve the passing of musicians, authors, actors, and other prominent or influential people. It's a little weird, but it's also very real. (I say "for some reason" in the first sentence because Charlie Daniels wasn't ever a favorite of mine, so I can't say that particular news hit me.)
I wonder, though: whose passing really hit you hard, considering only people you didn't actually know? (Having shaken a hand at a meet-and-greet or something doesn't count as knowing them, I mean REALLY knew.) Did any affect you as much as a family member's passing has? And whose future passing do you think might be especially difficult for you?
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Post by kds on Jul 6, 2020 19:04:14 GMT
I definitely understand why the passing of a prominent entertainer or athlete is upsetting. Even though I've been pretty vocal about my "art over artist" stance, this is still a person whose art had an impact on peoples' lives.
For me personally, Ronnie James Dio's death in 2010 probably hit me the hardest. Partly because it was so unexpected. I knew he had stomach cancer, but by all accounts, he was going to beat it, and even planned some gigs with Heaven and Hell for the summer of 2010. Then, one day, he's gone.
The other is Mike Flanagan, a former pitcher, coach, co-GM, and broadcaster with the Baltimore Orioles who took his own life in August 2011. The news leaked out during an Orioles broadcast, but they didn't mention it until after the game was over. It was very hard to watch former teammate and fellow broadcaster Jim Palmer struggling to maintain his composure during the post game show when they broke the news on Flanagan.
Granted, I wouldn't compare either of these deaths with that of a family member or friend, but they were pretty tough.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Jul 7, 2020 11:40:39 GMT
For some reason, and I haven't been able to figure out exactly why, I am affected by musicians'/artists' deaths more than I should. Whether they passed away tragically at an early age, or were fortunate to live into old age, their passings affect the way I view or relate to their work, sometimes minor, sometimes significantly. I guess it's just a matter of appreciation of their art, and being sad that they are no longer in this world to share it with me, to enjoy it/life on their own, or just being alive for us to appreciate them or thank them.
The death that has affected me the most has easily been Jim Morrison's. For fifty years I have been frustrated that I never got to see him live in concert, and especially frustrated that he and The Doors - who I believe had so much more to offer - were not able to continue on for several decades. Ray Manzarek's death at 74 hit me hard, too, because he served as a "living connection" to The Doors, I valued him still being an active performer, and sadly (and it's completely on me) that I never got to see him live. I remember hearing "Light My Fire" for the first time after Ray's passing and feeling very sad, realizing that this incredible musician who provided me so much happiness for years and years was no longer in this world.
Obviously, Dennis and Carl Wilson's deaths hit me hard. Not to appear insensitive, but Carl's death was sadder because I felt that he got more of a "bad break" where Dennis was self-destructive, and Carl still had so much to offer musically. Carl was only 51!
Other passings that affected me significantly include John Lennon and George Harrison. I still cannot enjoy The Beatles/John Lennon's music the same way since his death. I just can't get passed the senslessness of his murder. I can only imagine how those two passings affected Paul McCartney.
For some reason, Lou Reed's death got to me and I'm not sure why. I wasn't a diehard fan or anything. Johnny Cash's death was hard but not unexpected. Waylon Jennings, Glen Campbell, and Merle Haggard's passings were sad but all not entirely unexpected. All four Ramones have passed away which is sad. I was watching a Bee Gees' concert on PBS the other night and was really sad when thinking about Maurice and Robin Gibb's passings - and Andy Gibb's - with Barry being the last surviving brother, much like Brian Wilson.
Not to go off-topic because they weren't deaths, but the tragedies of Jan Berry and Syd Barrett are two that I have spent significant time thinking about.
I do OFTEN think "what if" when it comes to artists' death including Jimi Hendrix, Pete Ham of Badfinger, Terry Kath of Chicago, John Bonham of Led Zeppelin, and Kurt Cobain.
There are two popular singers of the 1950s/1960s whose music I enjoy who passed away at a young age and that would be Nat King Cole (who died at age 45) and Mario Lanza (who passed away at age 38). Frank Sinatra, and Andy Williams' passings were tough but they were in their 80's. Sammy Davis, Jr.'s sad passing from throat cancer was a tough one.
The future passings that will be difficult? Obviously all of the Beach Boys. Bob Dylan. Paul McCartney. Mick and Keith. Willie Nelson of course. Clapton. I could go on. The only consolation with those older artists is that they got everything possible out of their talents and basically recorded and performed almost up to the end of their lives.
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bellbottoms
Pacific Coast Highway
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Post by bellbottoms on Jul 7, 2020 12:52:58 GMT
There have definitely been some musician and other celebrity deaths that I grieved. When you admire someone for their contributions to the world and your life, it can feel a lot like losing a friend. Thankfully, we have their music, books, movies, art and other documents to look back on and enjoy.
The ones that hit the hardest were George Harrison, Jeff Healey, David Bowie, Tom Petty, Gord Downie of the Tragically Hip, and you’re going to laugh at me but… Steve Irwin, the Crocodile Hunter (I was a fan, and had visited Australia Zoo and saw him do a demonstration at the zoo only months before he died). I’m sure there are others, but those are the ones that jump to mind immediately.
Jeff Healey and David Bowie were the really big ones, in that list. I really did cry and mourn as if I had lost someone dear to me. As for who I will likely grieve for in the future, well… you know. I don’t even want to talk about it.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Jul 7, 2020 15:18:06 GMT
I sometimes wonder if there is a direct link between sentimentality and music. Is sentimentality stronger in music lovers? Eventually, all music is in the past (duh!), and it can take on a different meaning or significance as we - and the music - ages. It sometimes goes beyond just associating the songs with where we were at that particular time in our lives. It's deeper than that. It's almost a spiritual thing. It can be a very important bond. Am I getting carried away here?
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Post by kds on Jul 7, 2020 15:26:11 GMT
I sometimes wonder if there is a direct link between sentimentality and music. Is sentimentality stronger in music lovers? Eventually, all music is in the past (duh!), and it can take on a different meaning or significance as we - and the music - ages. It sometimes goes beyond just associating the songs with where we were at that particular time in our lives. It's deeper than that. It's almost a spiritual thing. It can be a very important bond. Am I getting carried away here? No, I think there's something to be said for that, and it's one of the reasons we love the music we love.
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bellbottoms
Pacific Coast Highway
Posts: 727
Likes: 201
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Post by bellbottoms on Jul 7, 2020 15:49:39 GMT
I sometimes wonder if there is a direct link between sentimentality and music. Is sentimentality stronger in music lovers? Eventually, all music is in the past (duh!), and it can take on a different meaning or significance as we - and the music - ages. It sometimes goes beyond just associating the songs with where we were at that particular time in our lives. It's deeper than that. It's almost a spiritual thing. It can be a very important bond. Am I getting carried away here? It does seem that musicians dominate the list of those we grieve, and as KDS pointed out, as music fans that makes total sense for us. But as soon as I read this comment I was knocked over by one who wasn't a musician - Robin Williams. That was a major one. And with him it's sentimental as well. He didn't just make us laugh. He had a gift for touching the human soul and enriching lives. I think some artists transcend their medium and become so relatable that we can't help but grieve their loss and miss them when they're gone.
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Post by Kapitan on Jul 7, 2020 16:10:55 GMT
I think artists in general have that power to affect us. Musicians might be more prominent than some others because they rarely obviously are playing characters, but rather appear to be communicating themselves to us. (The truth of that statement--that they aren't playing characters--is probably another question entirely.) So when a musician dies, more people likely see it as a person they've come to know and love; whereas an actor or novelist might more often just be seen as someone who was good at pretending.
But I think artists in general affect us more deeply because of the nature of art. Sometimes politicians creep into this territory, but usually we reserve those heartfelt reactions to people who find creative ways to connect over the biggest issues, the greatest joys, the worst despair: that's artists. Artists are often the best society has for helping us understand shared humanity.
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Post by kds on Jul 7, 2020 16:31:36 GMT
I think artists in general have that power to affect us. Musicians might be more prominent than some others because they rarely obviously are playing characters, but rather appear to be communicating themselves to us. (The truth of that statement--that they aren't playing characters--is probably another question entirely.) So when a musician dies, more people likely see it as a person they've come to know and love; whereas an actor or novelist might more often just be seen as someone who was good at pretending.
But I think artists in general affect us more deeply because of the nature of art. Sometimes politicians creep into this territory, but usually we reserve those heartfelt reactions to people who find creative ways to connect over the biggest issues, the greatest joys, the worst despair: that's artists. Artists are often the best society has for helping us understand shared humanity.
Plus, a lot of us have been lucky enough to see some of our favorite musicians practice their craft in person on stage. So, I feel like as a result, people feel more of a personal connection with their favorite musicians.
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Post by Kapitan on Jul 7, 2020 16:40:48 GMT
That's true.
My second-favorite art form after music is almost certainly literature. The work of my favorite authors is as important to me as the work of my favorite musicians. In both cases, many of the people who made my favorite work were dead before I was born, or before I was aware of them.
But of those for whose deaths I was old enough to be affected, it's certainly the musicians I grieved more--and not by a small margin. And that may well be partly because I could (and did) see Prince perform several times; not once did I spend 3 hours watching and listening to Saul Bellow in person...
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Post by kds on Jul 7, 2020 16:50:26 GMT
I think, for me, I put athletes just second to musicians. He's about to turn 60, so I'm hoping it won't be for a while, but when Cal Ripken Jr. dies, it'll hit me hard. He was a pillar and an icon in Baltimore. I got to see him play in person more times than I can count, and even got to meet him a few times. Between going to games and watching them on TV, pro athletes have made up a big part of my life.
After musicians and athletes, I'd go movies / TV. But, to me, those are little less so because, as you said, they're characters. For example, I got more emotional watching the series finale of The Office than the death of any actor.
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