|
Post by Sheriff John Stone on Dec 13, 2022 18:39:17 GMT
A question for the group about "God Rest Ye Merry Gentlemen" from What I Really Want For Christmas. Brian employed a very lively and almost rockin' arrangement. His lead vocal is strong and direct. However, during the song, a few times while singing, he changes keys and goes from his regular voice into a lower voice/key. Does anybody find it odd, distracting, or almost amateurish? I don't think he really sells it, the vocal change that is. I keep hearing Mike or Al's voice in there as possible substitutes.
|
|
|
Post by Kapitan on Dec 13, 2022 19:09:35 GMT
What he's doing is dropping an octave for that part (which isn't the same as changing keys: it means he's singing the same notes, but one octave down). The song is in Bb minor, and that part gets up relatively high for his modern voice: it's F, Gb, Eb, F, Gb, Ab, Bb, F, Eb, Db, Bb, C, Db, Eb.
The interesting thing is, in the final line of each verse, he actually does sing those higher notes: that line goes Db, Eb, F, Gb, Ab, Bb, F, Eb, Db, C, Bb. So he could hit those notes. My guess is that it was easier for him to nail it just in that one ascending pattern, but not to hit them when the melody skips around a bit more and continues afterward the way it does in the passage he dropped the octave.
It's not totally uncommon for people to do that when things go out of their range either up or down, but it isn't ideal, either. I don't like it, frankly. I'd rather that someone else took that line, if nothing else. Or they could have always tried the studio trickery of blending voices at different volumes for different moments so it's not entirely clear what's happening, now it's Brian, now it's Jeff, wait, no, it's Brian. (Some of TWGMTR does that and a lot of NPP does.) But I am glad Brian didn't just go for it if he couldn't do it. I know some people like when he reaches for those notes, but frankly sometimes it sounds awful. I'd rather let someone who can hit them, hit them.
|
|
|
Post by kds on Dec 13, 2022 19:21:12 GMT
A question for the group about "Gods Rest Ye Merry Gentlemen" from What I Really Want For Christmas. Brian employed a very lively and almost rockin' arrangement. His lead vocal is strong and direct. However, during the song, a few times while singing, he changes key and goes from his regular voice into a lower voice/key. Does anybody find it odd, distracting, or almost amateurish? I don't think he really sells it, the vocal change that is. I keep hearing Mike or Al's voice in there as possible substitutes. I've never minded it. Though, I always wondered, had the song been recorded later, would those lines have been sung by another singer, Al, Blondie, a mystery guest?
|
|
|
Post by Kapitan on Dec 13, 2022 19:27:03 GMT
I think Al or Blondie could just have sung it in the original octave (as could probably anyone else tapped to do it, whether Jeff, Matt, Darian, etc.); Mike (if we go that route) would have had to do the same octave drop Brian did, so it may have sounded similarly jarring.
|
|
|
Post by kds on Dec 13, 2022 20:01:44 GMT
Although, speaking of Blondie, I'm personally thankful he wasn't in the fold when Brian recorded an album with O Holy Night
I generally enjoy Blondie's contributions to Brian's concerts, but had I attended one of the Christmas shows from 2018, I've have been pretty disappointed to hear this instead of something resembling the BW studio version.
|
|
|
Post by Kapitan on Dec 13, 2022 20:14:51 GMT
Glad Sheriff John Stone posted in this thread to bump it, because frankly I'd forgotten I hadn't voted yet ... or even listened much. But now I guess I'm ready to weigh in.
Best: The First Noel Just by a (red?) nose, this beats out On Christmas Day and a few others. I actually enjoy this album far more than I do most Christmas albums ... I think maybe including the Beach Boys' own. The First Noel has what Marilyn described in the old Endless Harmony doc (in a good way) as "that whine," and I love it here. You hear it on "the angels did say," for example. On Christmas Day is a great one, too, probably my favorite of the Wilson originals on the album. It gets bumped just because it doesn't seem as professionally recorded as do the others. (It was originally a website release, wasn't it? So maybe just a quickie.) I like a lot of this album, though, and there are a lot of moments throughout that I could point to as highlights.
Worst: Silent Night Another website release, wasn't it? Definitely sounds hastily and sloppily done in that Wall-of-Brian, GIOMH kind of way. For the songs on the album proper, I'd probably say Hark the Herald Angels Sing. It's OK, but it is unremarkable and goes on too long (how many verses do we need? Reminds me of church services when the hymn wouldn't say v1-3, but like v1-4, 6, 7 or something...). I also differ with SJS on Joy to the World, where Brian doesn't just sound relaxed, but sedated. I like the backgrounds, but wish he'd given the lead a bit more clarity and oompf.
|
|
|
Post by lonelysummer on Dec 13, 2022 20:19:28 GMT
What he's doing is dropping an octave for that part (which isn't the same as changing keys: it means he's singing the same notes, but one octave down). The song is in Bb minor, and that part gets up relatively high for his modern voice: it's F, Gb, Eb, F, Gb, Ab, Bb, F, Eb, Db, Bb, C, Db, Eb.
The interesting thing is, in the final line of each verse, he actually does sing those higher notes: that line goes Db, Eb, F, Gb, Ab, Bb, F, Eb, Db, C, Bb. So he could hit those notes. My guess is that it was easier for him to nail it just in that one ascending pattern, but not to hit them when the melody skips around a bit more and continues afterward the way it does in the passage he dropped the octave.
It's not totally uncommon for people to do that when things go out of their range either up or down, but it isn't ideal, either. I don't like it, frankly. I'd rather that someone else took that line, if nothing else. Or they could have always tried the studio trickery of blending voices at different volumes for different moments so it's not entirely clear what's happening, now it's Brian, now it's Jeff, wait, no, it's Brian. (Some of TWGMTR does that and a lot of NPP does.) But I am glad Brian didn't just go for it if he couldn't do it. I know some people like when he reaches for those notes, but frankly sometimes it sounds awful. I'd rather let someone who can hit them, hit them.
This is a topic near and dear to my heart, because I am presently working on a couple cover tunes that are just on the edge of my vocal range, and the question I pose to myself is "do I strain to hit a few notes here and there, or do I drop down an octave?" In Brian's case, he should have just turned those parts over to a band member. If it was a Beach Boys recording (yes, I said it), Al would do those parts; or Matt, or Ike. Good question!
|
|
|
Post by Kapitan on Dec 13, 2022 20:23:01 GMT
It's tough, because a person not only has to hit the notes, but have the real self-judgment to decide whether s/he sounds good hitting the notes. Sometimes straining your range sounds amazing ... sometimes it sounds like trash. I know when I record, since it's just me, I just do it. But if I were trying to do real-life recordings for popular consumption, I'd be rearranging or handing off certain parts to be sure.
Brian did the safe thing here, but it is a little jarring. I'd have rather he handed it off for a bit, or blended.
|
|
|
Post by Sheriff John Stone on Dec 13, 2022 20:57:14 GMT
Along this topic, I do agree with kds and others that, yes, had Brian recorded this song/album later in his solo career, he might've handed that part off to Al, Blondie, or even somebody else. I'm thinking No Pier Pressure here...
I haven't made a contradictory statement in a couple of weeks so here goes one. As I have posted in this thread and several other times, I'm not a big fan of What I Really Want For Christmas, mostly because of the shouting. However, I would not have minded - and I think it would've improved the album significantly - if Brian made the project more of a family/friends/group affair. Brian had a lot of talent available to him with Carnie & Wendy, Al and Blondie, and even his backing band. By spreading vocals around, both lead and backing, I think the songs would've benefited. Anything to avoid Brian singing lead on 13-15 tracks.
OK, here's the contradictory part, in a way. We'll be getting to it soon, but I don't like how Mike made Reason For The Season a quasi-Love Family album. I wouldn't have had a big problem with a Christian Love vocal due to his Beach Boys' status and his vocal talent. But, I really didn't see the reason to bring in the lesser talents which would be his daughters. Again, I have no problem with a little family contribution, but those later tracks when Mike's daughters come in really brings down the album for me. I mean, hey, what about Bruce or Jeff (though I don't know Jeff's physical condition around the time of the recording). More on that later.
|
|
|
Post by kds on Dec 13, 2022 21:21:25 GMT
I actually really like the majority of Brian's vocals on WIRWFC. The one exception might be the chorus on Christmasey, which sounds a bit awkward, although the song itself makes up for it.
|
|
|
Post by Kapitan on Dec 13, 2022 21:26:16 GMT
I think Christmasey was too wordy for him. It's a cool song, but he seemed to struggle pronouncing the words in the chorus.
Mostly I agree about his performance on the album, though. I thought he sang pretty well--probably better than he had just recently done on BWPS, but not quite as good as on TLOS (which I think might be his solo career high point, vocally speaking--that or Imagination). Because of that, I'm fine with him taking so many lead vocals. That said, his whole solo career I've been up for him doling out a few more, be they full songs or (better yet) lines or parts here and there, the way they did in the Beach Boys. I know I'm a broken record on that, but I think he underused the great singers he's had in his band over the years. They are better than just harmony or background vocalists. I know we pay to hear Brian Wilson ... but is it really just to hear him singing leads, no matter the quality? Or is it to hear his songs, his arrangements? For me, it's more the latter.
|
|
|
Post by B.E. on Dec 13, 2022 23:38:02 GMT
Not being as familiar with other versions of "God Rest Ye Merry Gentlemen", I never thought anything was amiss! Now that I know, I'm not quite convinced it wasn't - at least, in part - a creative decision. I like the effect.
|
|
|
Post by B.E. on Dec 13, 2022 23:41:25 GMT
Also, I have no interest in trading Brian leads for Blondie leads. Sorry.
|
|
|
Post by lonelysummer on Dec 14, 2022 3:12:48 GMT
Along this topic, I do agree with kds and others that, yes, had Brian recorded this song/album later in his solo career, he might've handed that part off to Al, Blondie, or even somebody else. I'm thinking No Pier Pressure here...
I haven't made a contradictory statement in a couple of weeks so here goes one. As I have posted in this thread and several other times, I'm not a big fan of What I Really Want For Christmas, mostly because of the shouting. However, I would not have minded - and I think it would've improved the album significantly - if Brian made the project more of a family/friends/group affair. Brian had a lot of talent available to him with Carnie & Wendy, Al and Blondie, and even his backing band. By spreading vocals around, both lead and backing, I think the songs would've benefited. Anything to avoid Brian singing lead on 13-15 tracks.
OK, here's the contradictory part, in a way. We'll be getting to it soon, but I don't like how Mike made Reason For The Season a quasi-Love Family album. I wouldn't have had a big problem with a Christian Love vocal due to his Beach Boys' status and his vocal talent. But, I really didn't see the reason to bring in the lesser talents which would be his daughters. Again, I have no problem with a little family contribution, but those later tracks when Mike's daughters come in really brings down the album for me. I mean, hey, what about Bruce or Jeff (though I don't know Jeff's physical condition around the time of the recording). More on that later.
speaking of shouty...when a note or series of notes are hard for me to hit, the only way I can sing them is by shouting them. Is this why Brian sometimes sings shouty?
|
|
|
Post by B.E. on Dec 14, 2022 3:27:02 GMT
speaking of shouty...when a note or series of notes are hard for me to hit, the only way I can sing them is by shouting them. Is this why Brian sometimes sings shouty? Partially, I think. But he also just had a natural inclination to sing that way going all the way back to the early '60s. Nearly all rock 'n' roll singers shout to some extent (as they should...it's rock 'n' roll!). It just sounds better when singers are younger and their voices are in better shape. But, again, with Brian, yes, I think he started to shout more to compensate, but in every instance he ever shouted into a microphone, he could have sung falsetto if he wanted to but chose not to. At times, he's had a thing about sounding manly/macho. He'd rather sing gruff or shout. It's not just a range thing, IMO. But there's no right or wrong choice. There's better or worse technique. There's subjective taste.
|
|