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Post by B.E. on Nov 14, 2021 23:52:30 GMT
So, this is an album I hadn't heard until a few years ago when I was working my way through Ringo's discography - just as we are now. I thought it was OK, but I couldn't help but get the sense that I wanted to like it a little more than I actually did. At the time, I gave it a 5, but looking at my notes I think I was unnecessarily harsh. I listened to the album twice this week and both times I enjoyed it pretty much from start to finish. I appreciate the production values. It doesn't sound like an 80s album, or even a 70s album. For the most part, this is straight guitar, bass, drums (and piano) rock and roll. The lead off track, "In My Car", sounds a little generic (i.e. 80s pop/rock, songwriting-wise), but it's fine. Quite good, actually. I could be wrong, but it sounds to me like the type of song that would have been successful at the time. Then "Hopeless" and "Alibi" are very strong tracks. The former fits Ringo like a glove (e.g. "doc, I'm seeing double, and how are both of you?"). I think it would have fit in on his mid-70s albums. The latter I like even more. I'd definitely have that on a Top Ringo song list, I think. "She's About A Mover" is another highlight. The horns are fun. Reminds me of Bambu-era Dennis Wilson. "Be My Baby" is an otherwise enjoyable "filler" track but the talk box action is FAR too prominent. I'm really not a fan of too much of that. All in all, Side 1 is pretty strong. Side 2 dips a bit. "I Keep Forgettin'" has a cool groove and some fine guitar work (like much of the album does) but I'm not too keen on the parts Ringo sings in a lower register (and there's a weird effect on his voice there). I didn't realize until today that it's a cover. It probably helps that I'm not attached to the originals. "Picture Show Life" is pretty good. Sounds like it would fit right in on Ringo's Rotogravure. The "in their own little..." section, sounds pretty darn '80s to me, songwriting-wise. I think the production lets this section down a bit. It could have been more effective, IMO. "As Far As We Can Go" is the last true song on the album. Again, I think it's good, with a very good vocal from Ringo. Like I said earlier, though, I think the album version suffers in comparison to the original due to the synth work (reminding us, unnecessarily, that this is indeed an 80s album!). Closing the album with two quasi-instrumentals is a choice, but I dig 'em both. I think my bias against instrumentals got in the way last time, but these rock. The guitar work, the bass, piano, and drums...all cookin'. That's the thing I like about this album. It's got some energy. It rocks. It's got a natural sound to it. The material isn't great, but it's not bad either. I ended up raising my rating a whole point to a high 6 - surpassing Beaucoups of Blues, Choose Love, and Ringo the 4th in the process. I kinda feel bad demoting Ringo the 4th out of the top 10, but I think Old Wave's production is just that much less of a deterrent.
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Post by Kapitan on Nov 14, 2021 23:54:44 GMT
You're more generous than I find myself able to be.
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Post by B.E. on Nov 15, 2021 0:13:15 GMT
You're more generous than I find myself able to be. I appreciate, though, that there are just SO MANY other albums one could be listening to. But, really, that's true of every album outside of our absolute favorites.
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Post by Kapitan on Nov 15, 2021 13:50:43 GMT
Today is the final day to vote on Ringo Starr's Old Wave, due to the Ringo Rule (which, btw, will probably be expanding to other albums shortly...).
If you haven't listened and voted and commented, please do.
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Post by Kapitan on Nov 15, 2021 15:26:32 GMT
I've got to go with a 4. It's another slightly different approach from Ringo--he was willing to try new sounds, new collaborators, I'll give him that--but the same basic result, which is to say a lot of mediocre filler. And in some ways, Ringo feels oddly absent from the album overall. There are two near-instrumentals and other songs where it feels like Joe Walsh's production and playing are the featured aspects of the tunes.
“In My Car” is fine, generic rock. One thing that jumps out at me is how little of Ringo’s voice we hear in it! I doubt it’s even one minute’s worth in the 3:13 of the song. The slide guitar in “Hopeless” sounds to me like an Eagles song, though the song itself doesn’t. “Alibi” sounds like filler, and it’s just the third song… The funkier sound of “Be My Baby” is almost cool. But I don’t like the talk box, and Ringo is not strong on the lead. Those two elements, of course, are actually the featured parts of the song. So that’s a bad sign. It also feels like it drags on too long, despite being only about three and a half minutes long. “She’s About a Mover” is the kind of strong-backbeat song that I think fits Ringo a bit more naturally than some other songs. It’s probably the second-best song so far (after “In My Car”). Cool guitar solo, and the New Orleans style horn free-for-all solo is a lot of fun. Strangely, Ringo isn’t drumming on this one. I know “I Keep Forgettin” is a Leiber/Stoller song, but it’s a dud. Or at least this presentation is a dud. I always look to the first and last song of each side as important in judging an album, and this one kicks off side two. That is not a good sign for me. The percussion breakdown into the reverse echo guitar solo to kill the final 45-50 seconds isn’t appealing. I find “Picture Show Life” boring, though Ringo doesn’t have to strain much on the vocal, which is good for him. And note that Joe Walsh really was leaning into guitar effects on this album. A Russ Ballard ballad … that’s not something I necessarily would have predicted. The dramatic style and piano-and-keyboards instrumental base really is a strange fit for Ringo, but he does a pretty good job with it despite the relatively sophisticated melody and change. All that said, is it good? If you can’t say something nice, say nothing… But how about that synth-orchestral instrumental solo? Kudos to Walsh on that. I believe B.E. said this isn't as good as the original: where did it appear first, and by whom? I just did a quick googling and didn't see it from anyone earlier than this, but my efforts were minimal.“Everybody’s In a Hurry But Me” seems to be the most interesting back-story on the album, and it’s is perfectly fine to listen to. I haven’t yet heard the original version, which included Mssrs Entwistle, Clapton, etc., though to be fair I haven’t tried all that hard. I understand it was on some reissues, but not the ones represented on the sites and playlists I’ve seen.“Going Down” has a good groove from Ringo. It’s funny how they close the album with what amount to two near-instrumentals, though. Talk about filler.
I don't blame Ringo for not releasing another solo album for about a decade after this. Why would he? Labels didn't want him, the albums weren't selling anymore, it's not as if he had a stockpile of songs that just had to be released to the world... It seems to have become a somewhat desperate process repeating itself of trying some new sound, some new collaborator, then reverting to his old buddies, and all for what? By this point in his life, he had an apparently blissful marriage and didn't have to work.
Unfortunately he has said since that he was also really struggling with alcohol and drugs through the '80s (and '70s, actually), saying he lost entire years. But by the time we'll return to him--1992--he will have been sober for three years; and he remains so to this day.
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Post by B.E. on Nov 15, 2021 15:38:33 GMT
Kapitan - see the post I made prior to my review. That’s what I was referring to. I’ll link to a YouTube video of the original recording of AFAWCG later today.
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Post by Kapitan on Nov 15, 2021 15:41:43 GMT
Kapitan - see the post I made prior to my review. That’s what I was referring to. I’ll link to a YouTube video of the original recording of AFAWCG later today. Oh my gosh, you are entirely right and I've been repeatedly posting erroneously based on a misreading. I somehow glossed entirely over the change of subject from the first to the second sentence in the Wiki entry, pasted below! Apologies to anyone I've confused by my own confusion.
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Post by B.E. on Nov 16, 2021 0:10:56 GMT
Sorry, no luck finding the original recording of "As Far As We Can Go" in good quality on YouTube. I know it used to be there. Must have been taken down when the official album was uploaded. lonelysummer - did you give this album a chance?
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Post by lonelysummer on Nov 16, 2021 3:00:07 GMT
Sorry, no luck finding the original recording of "As Far As We Can Go" in good quality on YouTube. I know it used to be there. Must have been taken down when the official album was uploaded. lonelysummer - did you give this album a chance? Haven't had a chance to listen to it yet.
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Post by Kapitan on Nov 16, 2021 11:54:31 GMT
Three voters rated Ringo Starr' Old Wave a 5.0.
Thanks for participating. Our next album will be up shortly.
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Post by Kapitan on Nov 16, 2021 11:56:22 GMT
Paul McCartney, Pipes of Peace (1983)Paul McCartney’s 1981 sessions with George Martin were fruitful enough that they yielded more material than landed on his 1982 album Tug of War; indeed, songs from those sessions comprised about half of his October 1983 album Pipes of Peace. One might ask why the year-and-a-half delay, then, between the April 1982 Tug of War and its October 1983 successor. One reason was that McCartney spent much of late 1982 and the first half of 1983 working on his film Give My Regards to Broad Street (which was eventually released about a year after Pipes of Peace, in October 1984). Pipes of Peace seems very much a Vol. 2 of Tug of War, either a second disc or a continuation or sorts. In fact, the mash-up “Tug of Peace”combines elements of the title songs of both albums, making it all but impossible to miss the connection. But that half the album’s material was recorded in the same sessions as its predecessor and that it was also produced by George Martin makes the comparisons and similarities inevitable. The vintage of some of the songs also means Denny Laine makes one final appearance on a Paul McCartney album: he plays electric and acoustic guitars on “Keep Under Cover,” “Average Person,” and “Hey Hey,” each of which dates back to February 1981 (or in the case of “Keep Under Cover,” December 1980). Pipes of Peace was another album of diverse contributors, many of whom also appeared on Tug of War: Stanley Clarke, Steve Gadd, Eric Stewart, Ringo Starr, Linda McCartney. And while Stevie Wonder was absent from this album, McCartney did feature another former child star-turned-superstar from Motown, Michael Jackson. “Say Say Say,” a song cowritten by the two, was the first single from the album. It was a big hit, becoming Jackson’s seventh top-10 hit within a year and reaching #1 on the Billboard charts and #2 on the UK charts. Its video was also in heavy rotation on MTV. The second single was either the title track of “So Bad,” depending upon your country of residence. In the UK, “Pipes of Peace” was the A-side, while it was the B-side to “So Bad” in the US. “Pipes of Peace”—largely a McCartney solo performance on its basic track, with Linda McCartney and Eric Stewart contributing background vocals, with a pan flute, percussion, and a choir also added—reached #1 in the UK. “So Bad” didn’t fare quite as well in the states, peaking at #23. The other collaboration with Jackson, “The Man,” was scheduled to be the album’s third single, but it was canceled after the McCartneys were arrested for marijuana possession again, this time vacationing in Barbados. As always, critics’ reviews were mixed at best. Rolling Stone—Paul’s main antagonist over the years, it seems!—gave the album just two stars. NME was similarly harsh, saying it was "A dull, tired and empty collection of quasi-funk and gooey rock arrangements ... with McCartney cooing platitudinous sentiments on a set of lyrics seemingly made up on the spur of the moment.” In later years, as seem often to be the case, critics have become kinder. Pipes of Peace was another worldwide hit for McCartney, hitting #4 in the UK and #15 in the US, and performing well elsewhere in the world. It went platinum in both the US and UK. Please listen to, discuss, and rate Paul McCartney’s Pipes of Peace. www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_nvt35JHEIdnpHbANiyQKjgXff6CLkIS6w
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Nov 16, 2021 13:24:57 GMT
I wanted to buy Pipes Of Peace...but I didn't. I really liked Tug Of War, and looked forward to Paul's next album. Then he came out with "Say Say Say" and I was turned off big time. Too much Michael Jackson for me in such a short period of time. MTV played that video every hour and I hated it. And, what was it with Paul pairing up with these other "famous duet partners". Was it a money grab or an artistic decision? This was Paul Friggin' McCartney. He didn't need them so I thought! Then the "Pipes Of Peace" song/video followed. Meh. I like it much more today, though. Finally, "So Bad" came along and I loved it, despite the cheesy video (Ringo's faces should've been...omitted). However, it was too late and I ultimately passed on the album.
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Post by kds on Nov 16, 2021 13:30:40 GMT
Funny story about this album.
Back in the fall of 1992, a video rental chain called Erol's was going out of business. My father and I went to a local store to see if we could get some used video tapes on the cheap, and I found a copy of the Baltimore Orioles 1987 Video Yearbook. They did little segments on each player, accompanied by a song. The first player was first baseman Eddie Murray, and his song was some light rock song called "This is the Man." With it being the offseason, I watched that video quite a bit that fall. I also remember in 1994, when Murray played a game in Baltimore as a member of the Indians, that song was played over the PA during a tribute video.
Years turned to decades as they tend to do.
Then, last week, I listened to Pipes of Peace for the first time. Low and behold, there was a familiar song - The Man. I had no clue it was a McCartney / Michael song back in the way.
I love those little moments in music fandom. They really don't happen often anymore, but it's cool when they do.
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Post by Kapitan on Nov 16, 2021 13:53:27 GMT
And, what was it with Paul pairing up with these other "famous duet partners". Was it a money grab or an artistic decision?
It's hard to say, but at least I can note that this wasn't along the lines of "the Stevie Wonder duet worked, I should try it again!" And I say that because the sessions for the Wonder songs occurred in late February through March 1981, and the sessions for the Jackson songs were in May 1981 (which was before the Wonder songs were even completed, as overdubs and mixing occurred later). So it wasn't as if he saw the success of the Wonder collaboration and then decided to work with Michael.
I tend to believe McCartney when he said he'd always loved black American R'n'B musicians and, being a solo artist, wanted to work with some. He and Jackson had a kind of acquaintance/friendship going back into the late '70s, with "Girlfriend" having been written with Jackson in mind and Jackson covering it for Off the Wall. And the desire to work with Wonder--another multi-instrumentalist prodigy such as himself--makes perfect sense to me, whether or not the results live up to the idea.
The post-Wings era just offered the perfect opportunity. And it wasn't as if those two singers were the only people he was working with, after all. Carl Perkins was also dueting on the Tug of War album, and instrumentally you had several other people he said he simply wanted to play with: Stanley Clarke, Steve Gadd, etc.
But all that said, did commercial prospects influence the decisions? Probably. I mean, I'd hope so. You'd have to be an idiot not to consider the sales prospects of material you're selling.
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Post by Kapitan on Nov 16, 2021 14:51:37 GMT
While Pipes of Peace is a massive improvement over Old Wave--and no surprise there--I'm not a huge fan of it. I don't think it's as good as Tug of War. But it isn't bad, either. I'm less familiar with it, so it'll take me a few listens to say a whole lot.
There is something about Paul in this era where it seems like he's not sure what he wants to do. Beatlesque complex pop, schmaltzy ballads, funkier electronic fare, or what? Not that a musician has to do just one thing, by any means. A little stylistic variety keeps things interesting. But for whatever reason, sometimes that approach seems to be a plus, and other times a minus. It feels to me more like the latter in this case.
But also, I don't blame him. Not only is he now trying to continue a career after the breakup of the Beatles (which is a huge thing, the Ghost of Beatles Past), but to navigate the rapidly changing contemporary pop or rock scenes while in his 40s. In 1973, you could still see what was going on with your peers from a few years ago and be part of that royalty. But that royalty has turned to the old guard by the '80s. MTV is upon us. There are stars half your age.
As I've--and probably we all have--written before, the '80s seemed like a particularly challenging time for artists of the '60s and even '70s in some cases. A whole new world. Should you tease your hair, wear neon headbands or pastel jackets with the sleeves rolled? Replace your rhythm section with drum machines and synth bass? Toss out the real piano and organ for a Roland so someone can play those soft, airy tones of the day?
Edit - and something else on that: should a veteran change course to go with the times, it could easily be seen as selling out, or a cash grab. After all, our own Sheriff John Stone raised that very question with respect to McCartney pairing up with one of the hottest stars of that era.
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