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Post by jk on Feb 24, 2022 9:28:59 GMT
Unfortunately the video is unavailable in my part of the wilderness. I did a search for Symphony #3 and came up with this video performed by the Auckland Symphony Orch. Is this similar? If so, I'm impressed. Very nice piece and quite a powerful ending. That version sounds pretty good too. See if this alternative upload of the EPB/Ormandy recording works for you. The movement in question starts at 26:12:
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sockit
The Surfer Moon
Posts: 234
Likes: 181
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Post by sockit on Mar 2, 2022 0:41:06 GMT
Sorry if I'm taking us further from the Baroque subject, at least for now. Here's an interesting track that is on my Masterworks GH, a piece my father played for me quite often. It's Biggs playing Charles Ives' "Variations on 'America'". Fun little piece, but a bit of an oddity amongst the likes of Bach and Vidor, etc.
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Post by jk on Mar 2, 2022 10:29:02 GMT
Sorry if I'm taking us further from the Baroque subject, at least for now. Here's an interesting track that is on my Masterworks GH, a piece my father played for me quite often. It's Biggs playing Charles Ives' "Variations on 'America'". Fun little piece, but a bit of an oddity amongst the likes of Bach and Vidor, etc. That's beautiful! Some of those variations made me laugh out loud. And check out that pedal board part! Ives is amazing. My favourite work of his -- of anybody's, in fact -- is The Unanswered Question, most notably in this performance. You'll need to turn the volume up as the backdrop of strings is very quiet throughout. (I now own two copies of this LP!) I have no problem at all with the direction this thread may take, not least because we're its only participants right now. Sticking with EPB, this is him playing another of my all-time favourite works, Francis Poulenc's Concerto for Organ, Strings and Timpani in G Minor. In some ways, we're heading back to Baroque, as Poulenc studied works by Bach and Buxtehude when preparing to write for the organ for the first time -- and it shows!
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sockit
The Surfer Moon
Posts: 234
Likes: 181
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Post by sockit on Mar 3, 2022 1:06:39 GMT
That's beautiful! Some of those variations made me laugh out loud. And check out that pedal board part! Ives is amazing. My favourite work of his -- of anybody's, in fact -- is The Unanswered Question, most notably in this performance. You'll need to turn the volume up as the backdrop of strings is very quiet throughout. (I now own two copies of this LP!) I have no problem at all with the direction this thread may take, not least because we're its only participants right now. Sticking with EPB, this is him playing another of my all-time favourite works, Francis Poulenc's Concerto for Organ, Strings and Timpani in G Minor. In some ways, we're heading back to Baroque, as Poulenc studied works by Bach and Buxtehude when preparing to write for the organ for the first time -- and it shows! Well I'm certainly enjoying this discussion, and learning quite a bit. Expanding my musical horizons is something I try to do on a daily basis. The "Variations" is amusing in spots, isn't it? I remember as a child, thinking of scenarios to go with each theme. The first theme after the intro reminded me of a ceremony of some sort. Maybe an awards celebration, or a special church service. One theme I found pretty comical was what I called the Bullfighter Theme. It conjured up some pretty active images. The finale is so well suited to EPB's playing, so majestic! That was always my favorite part. "The Unanswered Question" is a piece that I have on a cd performed electronically by the late great synthesist Isao Tomita. His version is quite spacey, of course. The Poulenc piece is completely new to me, a bit of a shift in style. It sounds a bit dark in spots, and even a bit sinister. But it's certainly a good one, and I appreciate being introduced to it.
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Post by jk on Mar 3, 2022 9:10:56 GMT
The Poulenc piece is completely new to me, a bit of a shift in style. It sounds a bit dark in spots, and even a bit sinister. But it's certainly a good one, and I appreciate being introduced to it. Well, it was written between 1934 and 1938, when the clouds of war were gathering. There are airier moments too. One or two of these would have worked well in a Tchaikovsky ballet. But I agree, the unsettling side is never far away. I'm not a concerto person as a rule. I can't warm to the idea of one instrument being pitted against the rest. But there are a few exceptions and the Poulenc Organ Concerto is one of them.
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sockit
The Surfer Moon
Posts: 234
Likes: 181
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Post by sockit on Mar 3, 2022 23:56:12 GMT
I'm not a concerto person as a rule. I can't warm to the idea of one instrument being pitted against the rest. But there are a few exceptions and the Poulenc Organ Concerto is one of them. I certainly don't mind the ensemble setup as long as the organ is prominent. That's why I was just a bit put off by that one Bach selection you linked on the previous page (although I realize that one was all about the violas!) The Poulenc piece, on the other hand features just the right blend for me, where the organ is leading with a nice string backdrop.
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Post by jk on Apr 9, 2022 20:49:51 GMT
Ooohh, it's been a while... Heinrich Ignaz Franz Biber (1644–1704) wrote some truly remarkable music, much of which was way ahead of its time. This is his Battalia à 10 for strings and continuo, played here by Le Concert des Nations conducted by Jordi Savall: The scene is set in these excellent concert notes, which I reproduce here almost verbatim -- I've added the list of movements and the timings and tweaked odd bits: Battalia à 10 was written in 1673 during the Baroque era. Some historians have considered this work as expressing Biber's feelings about the Thirty Years' War, a religious war fought from 1618 to 1648. Beginning as a conflict between Protestants and Catholics, the war spread throughout most of Europe. The opposing sides often used mercenary armies, and the war brought with it famine and disease that devastated many countries. This war killed almost half of the male population of German-speaking lands and over a third of the Czech people. Battalia seems to be a statement about the social and historical impact of war and its toll on humanity. Battalia is often translated as "a body of troops" or simply as "battle". The piece is dedicated to Bacchus, the god of wine, vegetation, and the theatre, which immediately suggests notions of absurdity to both player and listener. In it Biber uses many non-traditional musical techniques, including striking the bow on the instrument, weaving paper through the strings and Ives-like polytonality. The piece is divided into eight short movements with the following titles: 00:00: I - Presto I 01:45: II - Die liederliche Gesellschaft von Allerley Humor (The Lusty Society of Common Humour) 02:32: III - Presto II 03:20: IV - Der Mars (March) 04:27: V - Presto III 06:02: VI - Aria 09:53: VII - Die Schlacht (The Battle) 10:36: VIII - Lamento der Verwundten Musquetirer (Lament of the Wounded Musketeers) The opening movement, "Sonata", is a lively flurry of activity employing pizzicati and col legno (using the wood rather than the hair side of the bow), in what is perhaps the first use of the technique. These techniques were used to imitate the soldiers' footsteps and the contrasts between soft and loud passages. In the second movement, "The Lusty Society of Common Humour", the troops have gathered in their separate camps. No fewer than eight different songs—in Czech, German, Slovak, Italian and other languages—are heard, in seven different keys, all at once and each starting at a different time. Biber gets his point across by remarking in one of the string parts that "Hic dissonant ubique nam ebrii sic diversis Cantilenis calamari solent" ("Here it is dissonant everywhere, for thus are the drunks accustomed to bellow with different songs"). This short, bizarre movement anticipates by over two hundred years similar juxtapositions by Charles Ives of unrelated types of music. After a short "Allegro" recalling the opening music comes "Mars", in which a drum-like rattle from the low strings, produced by having the bass players place a piece of paper in between the strings, accompanies a wild passage for solo violin that suggests a military fife. The ensuing "Presto" features a melody with a galloping rhythm and a hunting-horn quality, and the "Aria"—perhaps a prayer by the soldiers before the battle—is a sweet, song-like interlude. Then comes the actual "Battle", which is short but aggressive. To imitate the firing of cannon, Biber employs what in later days came to be known as the "Bartók pizzicato", where the string is plucked forcefully enough to snap against the fingerboard. Battalia concludes not with a song of victory but rather with the "Lament of the Wounded Musketeers", a funereal song of genuine pathos with some biting dissonances. [ Source]
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sockit
The Surfer Moon
Posts: 234
Likes: 181
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Post by sockit on Apr 10, 2022 15:11:50 GMT
Ooohh, it's been a while... Heinrich Ignaz Franz Biber (1644–1704) wrote some truly remarkable music, much of which was way ahead of its time. This is his Battalia à 10 for strings and continuo, played here by Le Concert des Nations conducted by Jordi Savall: The scene is set in these excellent concert notes, which I reproduce here almost verbatim -- I've added the list of movements and the timings and tweaked odd bits: Battalia à 10 was written in 1673 during the Baroque era. Some historians have considered this work as expressing Biber's feelings about the Thirty Years' War, a religious war fought from 1618 to 1648. Beginning as a conflict between Protestants and Catholics, the war spread throughout most of Europe. The opposing sides often used mercenary armies, and the war brought with it famine and disease that devastated many countries. This war killed almost half of the male population of German-speaking lands and over a third of the Czech people. Battalia seems to be a statement about the social and historical impact of war and its toll on humanity. Battalia is often translated as "a body of troops" or simply as "battle". The piece is dedicated to Bacchus, the god of wine, vegetation, and the theatre, which immediately suggests notions of absurdity to both player and listener. In it Biber uses many non-traditional musical techniques, including striking the bow on the instrument, weaving paper through the strings and Ives-like polytonality. The piece is divided into eight short movements with the following titles: 00:00: I - Presto I 01:45: II - Die liederliche Gesellschaft von Allerley Humor (The Lusty Society of Common Humour) 02:32: III - Presto II 03:20: IV - Der Mars (March) 04:27: V - Presto III 06:02: VI - Aria 09:53: VII - Die Schlacht (The Battle) 10:36: VIII - Lamento der Verwundten Musquetirer (Lament of the Wounded Musketeers) The opening movement, "Sonata", is a lively flurry of activity employing pizzicati and col legno (using the wood rather than the hair side of the bow), in what is perhaps the first use of the technique. These techniques were used to imitate the soldiers' footsteps and the contrasts between soft and loud passages. In the second movement, "The Lusty Society of Common Humour", the troops have gathered in their separate camps. No fewer than eight different songs—in Czech, German, Slovak, Italian and other languages—are heard, in seven different keys, all at once and each starting at a different time. Biber gets his point across by remarking in one of the string parts that "Hic dissonant ubique nam ebrii sic diversis Cantilenis calamari solent" ("Here it is dissonant everywhere, for thus are the drunks accustomed to bellow with different songs"). This short, bizarre movement anticipates by over two hundred years similar juxtapositions by Charles Ives of unrelated types of music. After a short "Allegro" recalling the opening music comes "Mars", in which a drum-like rattle from the low strings, produced by having the bass players place a piece of paper in between the strings, accompanies a wild passage for solo violin that suggests a military fife. The ensuing "Presto" features a melody with a galloping rhythm and a hunting-horn quality, and the "Aria"—perhaps a prayer by the soldiers before the battle—is a sweet, song-like interlude. Then comes the actual "Battle", which is short but aggressive. To imitate the firing of cannon, Biber employs what in later days came to be known as the "Bartók pizzicato", where the string is plucked forcefully enough to snap against the fingerboard. Battalia concludes not with a song of victory but rather with the "Lament of the Wounded Musketeers", a funereal song of genuine pathos with some biting dissonances. [ Source] Wow, you're blowing my mind this morning, jk ! (Well, it's morning here, anyways). This is all very new to me and quite fascinating. I read the full post before listening to the link. Kudos on your research! The historical rundown hit home with me since my family has German and Czech lineage. However, I don't know much about my ancestors or the history of that part of Europe, so it was a crash course in history for me. The musical work itself is quite interesting and will require repeated listenings for me to fully comprehend. My initial reaction is that, yes, it does sound quite modern for the 15th century. It's almost jarring and a little disturbing going from the lively opening movement to the dark dissonance of the second movement. Then it switches back to the lively theme, and then into the very military sounding "Der Mars". Fascinating piece. Thank you so much for sharing that! I've been out of the Baroque groove for awhile now!
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Post by Kapitan on Apr 10, 2022 16:04:23 GMT
I listened twice yesterday, and to me a lot of it sounded classical more than baroque, so moderately ahead of its time--except that very Ives-like part (Pt II?)! That astounded me. Never heard of such a thing so early.
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Post by jk on May 15, 2022 21:17:50 GMT
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