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Post by Kapitan on Apr 18, 2022 16:39:34 GMT
I'm not sure I'm ready to rate this. I've listened 1 & 1/2 times this morning and am at a loss. While I don't like it, I don't hate it in the way I hated, say, Press to Play (which I think remains my least favorite McCartney album). And it isn't even like the self-covers album or the covers albums, where I just don't care due to the format. And yet ... I just don't care.
Seems I ought to care, since it's a McCartney studio album of new material. I'd expect to be more interested. But even today as I am theoretically focusing on it, I keep finding myself realizing I've been working for 10 minutes without paying attention. The album lacks much in the way of hooks to bring me in.
I do like some of the music. The acoustic guitar playing on "The Kiss of Venus," the main lick for "Long Tailed Winter Bird," the Abbey Road medley-ish "Lavatory Lil" are some highlights for me. "Find My Way" and "Seize the Day" sound like Paul McCartney songs, they have their charms. But I was talking about hooks to bring me in: "Deep Deep Feeling" seems scientifically designed to push me away! It drew some of my strongest feelings of anything on the album, and not in a good way.
His voice, as you would expect, isn't what it was. But I think he compensates just fine: and thank goodness he didn't go the route that RoboRingo chose.
I need to look back at a few other lesser Paul albums for some points of reference. But I'm guessing I'll be in the 4-5 range.
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Post by lonelysummer on Apr 18, 2022 18:21:19 GMT
I can't rate it any higher than 3. Very mediocre Macca. So am I understanding we won't be rating the two EP's that Ringo put out last year? What about an overall solo career assessment for either?
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Post by Kapitan on Apr 18, 2022 18:34:37 GMT
I can't rate it any higher than 3. Very mediocre Macca. So am I understanding we won't be rating the two EP's that Ringo put out last year? What about an overall solo career assessment for either? No EPs have been part of this, studio albums only. So no, we will not be doing the EPs in this thread.
Overall assessments are good. I actually thought about pausing to do Ringo's before doing MIII, but decided to just get this last one out of the way first and then people can do their assessments for any- and everyone they haven't yet or want to, whether Ringo and Paul, the whole shebang, either of the others they've missed doing an assessment on, or whatever else.
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Post by The Cincinnati Kid on Apr 19, 2022 2:31:50 GMT
I was also pretty excited for this album when I first heard about it. The first single, Find My Way, is how I generally feel about the album as a whole. Very good track marred by some now very wobbly vocals. Would have been great to listen to 10 or maybe even five years ago. Women and Wives was stuck in my heard for a while. I'm going to with a six, which is what I gave New. This album is more even and doesn't have some of the highs or lows New has.
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Post by Kapitan on Apr 19, 2022 11:28:59 GMT
In the end, I'm going with a 4. Kind of a sad end to Paul's discography (to date, at least as relates to this thread).
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Post by kds on Apr 19, 2022 12:06:02 GMT
In the end, I'm going with a 4. Kind of a sad end to Paul's discography (to date, at least as relates to this thread). I'd really like to believe that Sir Paul McCartney has at least one more good album left in him. But, I really think it's going to take an involved producer like a Jeff Lynne, or maybe a Rubin or an Ezrin, to bring it out.
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Post by Kapitan on Apr 19, 2022 12:18:03 GMT
Sir Paul McCartney has at least one more good album left in him. But, I really think it's going to take an involved producer like a Jeff Lynne, or maybe a Rubin or an Ezrin, to bring it out. You know, I'm not sure about that. It has gone both ways with Paul as a solo artist, but I think his history with outside producers is maybe a little worse than without, George Martin and Jeff Lynne notwithstanding. Hugh Padgham, Mitchell Froom, Trevor Horn, David Kahne and others in the 80s and 90s, then everyone from Nigel Godrich to Greg Kurstin to Ryan Tedder in the 00s and 10s. But his best albums are almost all produced by Paul McCartney.
He might have more good albums in him, though. That I agree with. And while I'm not sure it's the producer aspect, I do think he needs a strong collaborator as a foil. That can be a producer or another artist. (That's why Lynne was so effective, I think. He was both someone who was thinking of the project on the whole in the producer role and able to pick up the guitar or bass and contribute in real-time.)
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Post by kds on Apr 19, 2022 12:21:45 GMT
Sir Paul McCartney has at least one more good album left in him. But, I really think it's going to take an involved producer like a Jeff Lynne, or maybe a Rubin or an Ezrin, to bring it out. You know, I'm not sure about that. It has gone both ways with Paul as a solo artist, but I think his history with outside producers is maybe a little worse than without, George Martin and Jeff Lynne notwithstanding. Hugh Padgham, Mitchell Froom, Trevor Horn, David Kahne and others in the 80s and 90s, then everyone from Nigel Godrich to Greg Kurstin to Ryan Tedder in the 00s and 10s. But his best albums are almost all produced by Paul McCartney.
He might have more good albums in him, though. That I agree with. And while I'm not sure it's the producer aspect, I do think he needs a strong collaborator as a foil. That can be a producer or another artist. (That's why Lynne was so effective, I think. He was both someone who was thinking of the project on the whole in the producer role and able to pick up the guitar or bass and contribute in real-time.)
Maybe those other producers just weren't very good fits. Lynne would be perfect I think, and I was hoping that Flaming Pie would the beginning of a long relationship. But, alas. Ezrin is another producer / collaborator that I think could work. He was responsible for some very good later era music from Pink Floyd and Deep Purple.
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Post by Kapitan on Apr 19, 2022 13:06:26 GMT
My biggest factor for the quality of Paul's music is really just the songs: when he has a good selection of songs, the albums are generally good. When not, not. If a producer is contributing in that respect--helping Paul choose and fine-tune his material--I'm all for it.
If a producer is shaping the actual sound of the album, I think that more often than not has been a net negative. That's when we get Paul-as-80s-pop or Paul-as-00s-pop, and it's disappointing.
So if he were choosing a new producer, I'd rather that producer say "Paul, this isn't an 8-minute song, you know...we don't need a 2-minute coda" than "Paul, let's use autotune to really bring that vocal melody up to date..."
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Post by kds on Apr 19, 2022 13:21:13 GMT
My biggest factor for the quality of Paul's music is really just the songs: when he has a good selection of songs, the albums are generally good. When not, not. If a producer is contributing in that respect--helping Paul choose and fine-tune his material--I'm all for it.
If a producer is shaping the actual sound of the album, I think that more often than not has been a net negative. That's when we get Paul-as-80s-pop or Paul-as-00s-pop, and it's disappointing.
So if he were choosing a new producer, I'd rather that producer say "Paul, this isn't an 8-minute song, you know...we don't need a 2-minute coda" than "Paul, let's use autotune to really bring that vocal melody up to date..."
Right, and I think that's where a guy like Lynne or Ezrin could come in, and be a part of the creative process. I could see a guy like Ezrin taking one of Paul's short song segments, and helping him flesh it out into a proper song.
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Post by Kapitan on Apr 19, 2022 13:37:22 GMT
Where I'm not sure of Ezrin, though, is that he is often very integral to shaping the sound, too. There is an "Ezrin stamp," and that's something I don't know that Paul needs or benefits from historically. Granted, rather than Padgham's gated drums and synth pads, I prefer Ezrin's choirs, strings, and sound effects. But I still don't think Paul needs that.
However, Ezrin also is known as a songwriting/editing collaborator, and Paul may benefit from that. (Need, no. Benefit from, yes. Everybody can use a strong sounding board.)
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Post by B.E. on Apr 20, 2022 0:52:24 GMT
I listened to MIII once when it was released. I was never motivated enough to listen to it again. I really didn't care for it. I've just begun listen #2 to III. I'm in a similar boat, except I haven't begun my fresh listen(s?) yet. But I was really underwhelmed when it was released. Barring a major reconsideration on my end, it's kind of a bummer to end this massive thread with that last Ringo album and this McCartney one. They certainly don't do justice to the great, very good, and even good stuff that has mostly come before. I agree with that sentiment regarding Ringo's last two albums, but not McCartney's. I think both Egypt Station and McCartney III are solid, respectable albums (especially considering how late in the game they are). I also happen to like Egypt Station and McCartney III just about equally, despite being quite different. I listened to both albums a decent amount upon release and have revisited each...I think McCartney III is actually aging a little better for me.
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Post by B.E. on Apr 20, 2022 1:06:19 GMT
Women and Wives was stuck in my heard for a while. Funny, that's the one that got stuck in my head last summer. I listened to it daily (and multiple times a day!) for a couple weeks. Not sure why, there's not a lot to it, but I was enjoying it very much. And that wasn't even a favorite, necessarily. I liked "Lavatory Lil", "The Kiss Of Venus", and "Winter Bird/When Winter Comes" more. And just to comment a bit more about the album - I think the opening tracks "Long Tailed Winter Bird" and "Find My Way" are pretty good. And beyond that, just about every track has some really cool elements: the guitar picking of "Pretty Boys", the drum pattern on "Slidin'", the arrangement of "Deep Deep Feeling" from 7:16 onward, some of the screams on "Deep Down", etc. And as I've said many times, I like this sort of "underproduced" production as well as the one-man-band approach (particularly when I'm a really big fan of the one man).
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Post by lonelysummer on Apr 20, 2022 1:39:06 GMT
I find myself enjoying Ringo's recent albums much more than Paul's; maybe it's lower expectations or something. I thought the Zoom In ep was very enjoyable, and it's brevity should be a plus with non-Ringo lovers (5 tracks). The newer one, Change the World is even shorter - only four songs. The more I dwell on this stuff, I wonder if maybe Neil Young was right - it's better to burn out than to fade away.
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Post by jk on Apr 20, 2022 6:59:27 GMT
I like McCartney III. I think it makes a worthy companion to I and II. I like the way it was never intended to be an album at all. And it has the same kind of autumnal feel as TWGMTT. I see it's too late for me to vote. It's great to be back but I rather fear 10 would meet with hoots of derision so maybe it's just as well.
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