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Post by Kapitan on Aug 23, 2020 11:59:42 GMT
Today is the last day for official discussion and rating Imagination, so please be sure to vote if you haven't, and chime in if there's more you've got to say.
Tomorrow something else goes live.
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Post by lonelysummer on Aug 24, 2020 6:22:42 GMT
I always thought there was a lack of Brian Wilson solo songs performed because of, in importance, 1) Brian doesn't care for them, 2) Brian would have to learn them (or something new(er)) as opposed to being on autopilot with the oldies, and 3) $$$$$$$$ - they want to keep selling tickets and most of the people at a BW solo concert are there for The Beach Boys' tunes. Now I agree with that. Even the rare times Brian would do a solo show during the Landy years - a time I perceive him to be much more focused on getting new music out to people - a big chunk of his live sets were the oldies - Surfer Girl, Good Vibrations, California Girls, etc. I think he always found it easier to just play the oldies. It's true that he was putting albums out on a pretty consistent basis from Live at the Roxy through No Pier Pressure, but the majority of that stuff was retreads of old material, and also, it's important to note, these did not seem to be projects that he spearheaded. It always seemed to be the case that one of his people - Melinda, Darian, Scott, JT - would come up with the idea and talk him into it. Back in the 90's, he was recording tons of stuff with Andy Paley - as I understand it, not because someone said "Brian, you need to make a record" - but simply because he wanted to. He seemed to be brimming with ideas for songs. In the last 20 years, it seems it's much more a case of Brian having burned out as a writer, but it doesn't matter, because people just want the same old songs anyway. That's why I kind of laughed about some of the promotion for Imagination. I could tell from the hard sell in the tv special that they really believed they could MAKE this album a hit. Melinda saying things like "each song on this album was deeply felt", and the fact that they had to rope in people like Sean Lennon and Eric Clapton to hype it. There was no way Brian Wilson was going to have a hit album in 1998, no matter how much they talked it up. Radio was not going to play it, Brian may have been respected by some in the alternative rock scene, but if those people were going to buy something of Brian's, they were going to go for Pet Sounds or a Smile bootleg. When it became clear that Brian had zero chance of making a commercial splash with any new music, they put him on the road. Gotta generate that income, gotta bring home the bacon for Melinda and family. And aside from a couple special tours to celebrate TLOS and BWPS, it's been all oldies all the time. So I look back at Imagination as the last shot by the Powers That Be to bring Brian into the present day as a hitmaker, a contemporary artist. The fact that it failed commercially does not change my opinion of the music - it's a mature Brian Wilson, making music that reflects his life as a 50-something instead of trying to be the eternal teenager like Mike Love.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Aug 24, 2020 9:47:51 GMT
I always thought there was a lack of Brian Wilson solo songs performed because of, in importance, 1) Brian doesn't care for them, 2) Brian would have to learn them (or something new(er)) as opposed to being on autopilot with the oldies, and 3) $$$$$$$$ - they want to keep selling tickets and most of the people at a BW solo concert are there for The Beach Boys' tunes. When it became clear that Brian had zero chance of making a commercial splash with any new music, they put him on the road. Gotta generate that income, gotta bring home the bacon for Melinda and family. And aside from a couple special tours to celebrate TLOS and BWPS, it's been all oldies all the time. This subject would necessitate a new thread (and we might have one already started), but I don't think Brian went out on the road for the money. Brian Wilson is a millionaire many times over; he didn't/doesn't need the money. Also, he wasn't making THAT much by touring anyway. He had a big band to pay and look at the size of the halls he was playing.
I've said it several times, but IMO Brian's touring was the recommendation of Brian's handlers (wifeandmanagers, physicians, psychiatrists, physical/occupational therapists, etc.) as a form of therapy, both physical and emotional. Brian "went along" with it. I'm sure the promotion of his new albums played some part. Of course Brian wanted his albums/singles to sell, and he also might've felt some obligation, albeit small, to his various record companies.
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Post by kds on Aug 24, 2020 12:18:25 GMT
I really don't even think Imagination was the last attempt at making a hit for Brian. The inclusion of several contemporary guests on NPP tells me that Team Brian was hoping to have some commercial success as recently as five years ago. Why they chose not to release any of those singles as singles is just......well, it's business as usual in Beach Boys World.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Aug 24, 2020 12:24:52 GMT
I don't think Brian will ever stop trying to get a hit record. It some ways it's a blessing because it provides motivation. On the other hand, considering he's had so few with The Beach Boys since 1968 ("Do It Again") and none as a solo artist, it's also provided him with sadness and maybe even some depression.
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Post by kds on Aug 24, 2020 12:28:17 GMT
I don't think Brian will ever stop trying to get a hit record. It some ways it's a blessing because it provides motivation. On the other hand, considering he's had so few with The Beach Boys since 1968 ("Do It Again") and none as a solo artist, it's also provided him with sadness and maybe even some depression. I agree with this, although, over the last five years, it seems Team Brian has thrown in the towel a bit when it comes to trying to be contemporary with the endless Pet Sounds Tour and the Greatest Hits shows (although the Christmas tours and Great in '68 Tours did offer something a bit different). But, he's hardly the first contemporary artist to do this, and won't be the last.
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Post by Kapitan on Aug 24, 2020 12:29:14 GMT
Nine voters have given Imagination an average rating of 6.4. The median and most common rating was 7.
Thanks for voting and for the good discussion. Six pages in a week on a 22-year-old, non-classic album!
Our next album will be up shortly.
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Post by kds on Aug 24, 2020 12:35:33 GMT
I just noticed that the 1 rating has disappeared. Perhaps somebody was swayed by feel good vibes of South American, a song that the more I listen to, the more it sounds like a mid 90s Buffett song than a Brian Wilson song (that's a compliment BTW).
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Post by Kapitan on Aug 24, 2020 12:40:58 GMT
I just noticed that the 1 rating has disappeared. Perhaps somebody was swayed by feel good vibes of South American, a song that the more I listen to, the more it sounds like a mid 90s Buffett song than a Brian Wilson song (that's a compliment BTW). It disappeared when the 3 appeared, so my guess was lonelysummer bumped his rating a few notches up. But that's just a guess.
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Post by B.E. on Aug 24, 2020 13:12:31 GMT
I just noticed that the 1 rating has disappeared. Perhaps somebody was swayed by feel good vibes of South American, a song that the more I listen to, the more it sounds like a mid 90s Buffett song than a Brian Wilson song (that's a compliment BTW). It disappeared when the 3 appeared, so my guess was lonelysummer bumped his rating a few notches up. But that's just a guess. I noticed the '1' disappeared when the '3' appeared, too. It wasn't lonelysummer, though, he rated it an '8'. Anyway, I'm glad "South American" or our posting or a fresh listen resulted in a positive change.
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Post by kds on Aug 24, 2020 13:15:55 GMT
One last thought on Imagination. I remember reading in a Beach Boys book, either by Andrew Doe or John Stebbins, that the "I'm doing lunch with Cameron Diaz" line in South American would date the song badly. I could see how one could think that in the late 90s, but I'd say time has proven that quote to be incorrect.
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Post by Kapitan on Aug 24, 2020 13:18:38 GMT
It disappeared when the 3 appeared, so my guess was lonelysummer bumped his rating a few notches up. But that's just a guess. I noticed the '1' disappeared when the '3' appeared, too. It wasn't lonelysummer, though, he rated it an '8'. Anyway, I'm glad "South American" or our posting or a fresh listen resulted in a positive change. Sorry, my mistake: I was thinking theprofessor when I wrote lonelysummer. theprofessor wrote that he wasn't a BW solo fan, etc., so it would make sense if it were him who gave the 3.
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Post by lonelysummer on Aug 25, 2020 0:34:55 GMT
I just noticed that the 1 rating has disappeared. Perhaps somebody was swayed by feel good vibes of South American, a song that the more I listen to, the more it sounds like a mid 90s Buffett song than a Brian Wilson song (that's a compliment BTW). It disappeared when the 3 appeared, so my guess was lonelysummer bumped his rating a few notches up. But that's just a guess. No, I rated the album a solid 8, and I stand by that. The only drop off in quality I hear is the last two songs.
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Post by lonelysummer on Aug 25, 2020 0:36:07 GMT
One last thought on Imagination. I remember reading in a Beach Boys book, either by Andrew Doe or John Stebbins, that the "I'm doing lunch with Cameron Diaz" line in South American would date the song badly. I could see how one could think that in the late 90s, but I'd say time has proven that quote to be incorrect. What has Cameron Diaz done in the last, say, 10 years?
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Post by B.E. on Aug 25, 2020 1:04:29 GMT
One last thought on Imagination. I remember reading in a Beach Boys book, either by Andrew Doe or John Stebbins, that the "I'm doing lunch with Cameron Diaz" line in South American would date the song badly. I could see how one could think that in the late 90s, but I'd say time has proven that quote to be incorrect. What has Cameron Diaz done in the last, say, 10 years? She retired from acting a few years ago. She co-starred with Tom Cruise in Knight and Day (2010). That's the last movie of hers I saw. Fun movie.
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Sept 30, 2024 19:53:42 GMT
Sept 30, 2024 19:53:42 GMT
