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Post by Kapitan on Apr 24, 2021 16:42:19 GMT
I keep thinking about the Wilson-James collaboration, trying to imagine what direction they took it. I'm not a My Morning Jacket fan--not due to dislike, just more lack of caring in casual, occasional listens--but I do hear things involving James occasionally that tickle my fancy.
This is a song he sang (and probably wrote music for, as that's how they handled it) with Dylan lyrics for the New Basement Tapes project. It's "Nothing To It" which to me sounds like a semi-countrified 1970ish Lennon more than any Wilson I can imagine.
I've shared elsewhere My Morning Jacket's "Run It," which I can imagine in a Holland-era vibe. But Brian was largely absent from that sound.
Here is My Morning Jacket's "Two Halves," which to me sounds like classic Raspberries. This is more where I can imagine some Wilson collaboration getting interesting.
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Post by lonelysummer on Apr 29, 2021 2:05:20 GMT
If or when this film comes out, I expect it will be another testimonial to the great Melinda Wilson - how she freed him from the clutches of the despicable Dr. Landy. Freed him, to tour endlessly, singing the old Beach Boys hits for a largely uncritical sea of worshippers. Freed him, to record other people's ideas of what will be commercially acceptable in (insert year). Freed him, to submit to regular interviews with members of the press (and give one word answers). Freed him, to be photographed as he rolls through airports in his wheelchair.
Maybe Covid-19 has been a blessing in disguise for Mr. Wilson. I certainly hope so.
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Post by bellesofparisstan on Apr 29, 2021 4:46:31 GMT
If or when this film comes out, I expect it will be another testimonial to the great Melinda Wilson - how she freed him from the clutches of the despicable Dr. Landy. Freed him, to tour endlessly, singing the old Beach Boys hits for a largely uncritical sea of worshippers. Freed him, to record other people's ideas of what will be commercially acceptable in (insert year). Freed him, to submit to regular interviews with members of the press (and give one word answers). Freed him, to be photographed as he rolls through airports in his wheelchair. Maybe Covid-19 has been a blessing in disguise for Mr. Wilson. I certainly hope so. I completely understand how you feel, and why you feel that way. However, I’d like to break it down point by point. “ I expect it will be another testimonial to the great Melinda Wilson - how she freed him from the clutches of the despicable Dr. Landy.” Well, she is listed as a producer on the film, so I would expect the very same thing. However, it’s not entirely untrue. Let’s not forget that old pill bottles that had expiration dates of over a decade beforehand were found in Brian’s office, put there by Landy. At the same time, a will was found where basically the majority of Brian‘s money and belongings went to Landy in the event of his death. Connecting the dots, you can see where things could have gone. And while Carl was the person who really put in the hard work, there is no doubt that Melinda definitely got the ball rolling when it comes to “freeing” Brian. “Freed him, to tour endlessly, singing the old Beach Boys hits for a largely uncritical sea of worshippers.” A lot of people forget this, but at first, the touring was necessary, and Brian was actually on board. He was deeply in debt, and needed to find a way to get out of it other than relying on old song royalties. Not to mention, he was a recovering drug addict who needed something to occupy his time with, a fantastic backing band, and fans who would pay lots of money to go and see him. He had just released a solo album, he was trying to kickstart a full come back, so Touring made all of the sense in the world. Then there was the pet sounds tour, the first time he had revisited that music deeply since it was first created in 1966. That inspired the Smile tour, which lead to That Lucky Old Sun, and then the Beach boys Reunion and Album. This all happened in a matter of 13 years, which for Brian was an amazingly short amount of time. Now I will agree that pretty much since 2015, the man has just been coasting, and he clearly doesn’t care that much anymore. But still, I’m not his doctor or anything, but from what has happened in the past, I’m pretty sure the reason that they’re trying to keep him touring is because he doesn’t do well when he has too much free time. He probably is physically and mentally at his best when he is on a routine, and if he were to stop touring, he basically wouldn’t have any routine at all other than the occasional interview. not that I fully agree with it, but I do understand it. also, it could just be that he, himself, doesn’t want to retire. Some people are like that, they see retirement as a weakness, a sign of impending death. Maybe he feels that if he just keeps pushing forward, maybe it will delay the inevitable as long as possible. “ Freed him, to record other people's ideas of what will be commercially acceptable in (insert year.” i’m guessing you’re referring to Joe Thomas, but the truth is that he is one of the few people who can seem to actually get results out of Brian that are quite decent. I’m not a fan of his adult contemporary production style either, but there’s absolutely no denying that imagination and NPP have some of Brian‘s clearest Vocals, as well as having some of his best song writing. Smile and the Gershwin album were clearly passion projects, especially the Gershwin album. The Disney album was a contractual obligation, and that lucky old son was a project that was started by Brian. I’ve even heard that he started writing that album when his wife was away for a couple days, and then Scott Bennett joined the project at a later date. But either way, I’m not seeing the link between brian’s Albums and Melinda‘s manipulation. “Freed him, to submit to regular interviews with members of the press (and give one word answers).” I’m not entirely sure what you’re talking about, there hasn’t been a really good Brian interview in years. The only time that I see frequent Brian interviews are when he has a new album coming out, and that’s about it. There were a lot of interviews in 1998 when imagination first came out, a lot of interviews around 2004 and 2005 during the whole Smile era, and around 2012 during the Beach boys reunion. Other than that, I haven’t seen an unusual amount of Brian interviews. he rarely gives any. As for the one word answers, that’s just the person that he is. He’s not a big fan of interviews, never has been. As for his low energy, that’s just what happens when you get older. He even commented on it in a 2004 interview. Someone showed him a clip of a 1976 interview, and he said something like “damn I wish I could still talk like that.” Either way, this documentary is supposed to have a hidden camera, car ride format that was put together to make him more comfortable and make it feel more like a real conversation, so I’m excited about that. Maybe will get a more genuine Brian interview this time. “Freed him, to be photographed as he rolls through airports in his wheelchair.” Yeah, I don’t really have a response to that one. It makes me uncomfortable too, but if it’s what he wants to do, it’s what he’s going to do. I just don’t understand why Melinda has anything to do with it. “Maybe Covid-19 has been a blessing in disguise for Mr. Wilson.” Well apparently he’s been walking every day and has been working with a vocal coach, so that’s good I guess. I hope the man is happy.
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Post by Kapitan on Apr 29, 2021 11:36:14 GMT
I think the point is, obviously it's more promotional film than documentary--as are most artists' "documentaries" these days. Taylor Swift, Justin Bieber, Beyonce, Brian Wilson, it doesn't much matter. I think kds said it'll be an extended EPK, and that's right. They always are.
Hopefully there will be something interesting out of it, something to make it worthwhile. But honestly (and I know I've said this before), I think we're going to get better documentaries and interviews after he's dead.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Apr 29, 2021 11:53:19 GMT
I think the point is, obviously it's more promotional film than documentary--as are most artists' "documentaries" these days. Taylor Swift, Justin Bieber, Beyonce, Brian Wilson, it doesn't much matter. I think kds said it'll be an extended EPK, and that's right. They always are.
I think had this film been released ten or twenty years ago this would've been true. But, now, with Brian pushing 80-years old, what is being promoted? I would expect Brian to perform some shows in the future but probably on a limited basis (at least I hope it's on a limited basis). So, in 2021-22, Brian Wilson doesn't need a vehicle to promote his touring. Is this film promoting his ongoing recording career? If Brian didn't compose a number of songs during this now 18-month pandemic (and if he did we probably would've heard about it), I'm not sure a recording career is something to promote either. That basically leaves his..."new" life...which has been the subject of numerous interviews, part of his book, and a movie. Again, employing total speculation, I wouldn't be surprised if the subjects of following his children's activities, walks/going to the deli, visits from old friends/musicians, watching TV, listening to music, and, yes, some tinkering in the studio are featured. THAT'S what can be promoted or celebrated, and basically was with the Love And Mercy film. Brian's second, or third, or fourth chance at finding love, family, safety, and security. And, I'm not saying that sarcastically. I really think Melinda wants that - and confronting mental illness - to be Brian's legacy over the last 25 years as much as In The Key Of Disney.
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Post by Kapitan on Apr 29, 2021 12:29:02 GMT
I didn't mean promotional as in "to promote [specific product]." I just meant it won't be an objective kind of documentary. It will be cloying and propagandistic. It'll paint him as a hero, as a survivor, as a long-abused/mistreated/neglected patient-victim who, through the love and support of his new family, has been able to thrive. That kind of thing. Just like we've seen 3-4-5-6 times already. Just a new cast of talking heads (Jim James), or new interviews with the old cast (Danny Hutton).
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Post by kds on Apr 29, 2021 12:42:19 GMT
I think the point is, obviously it's more promotional film than documentary--as are most artists' "documentaries" these days. Taylor Swift, Justin Bieber, Beyonce, Brian Wilson, it doesn't much matter. I think kds said it'll be an extended EPK, and that's right. They always are.
Hopefully there will be something interesting out of it, something to make it worthwhile. But honestly (and I know I've said this before), I think we're going to get better documentaries and interviews after he's dead.
That's why I hope they go outside the box, with no wife/managers as ED's for the BB documentary that's apparently on the horizon. I don't know if they could get Scorcese, but he's done very good docs on The Stones and George Harrison.
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Post by bellesofparisstan on Apr 29, 2021 12:43:34 GMT
I think the point is, obviously it's more promotional film than documentary--as are most artists' "documentaries" these days. Taylor Swift, Justin Bieber, Beyonce, Brian Wilson, it doesn't much matter. I think kds said it'll be an extended EPK, and that's right. They always are.
I think had this film been released ten or twenty years ago this would've been true. But, now, with Brian pushing 80-years old, what is being promoted? I would expect Brian to perform some shows in the future but probably on a limited basis (at least I hope it's on a limited basis). So, in 2021-22, Brian Wilson doesn't need a vehicle to promote his touring. Is this film promoting his ongoing recording career? If Brian didn't compose a number of songs during this now 18-month pandemic (and if he did we probably would've heard about it), I'm not sure a recording career is something to promote either. That basically leaves his..."new" life...which has been the subject of numerous interviews, part of his book, and a movie. Again, employing total speculation, I wouldn't be surprised if the subjects of following his children's activities, walks/going to the deli, visits from old friends/musicians, watching TV, listening to music, and, yes, some tinkering in the studio are featured. THAT'S what can be promoted or celebrated, and basically was with the Love And Mercy film. Brian's second, or third, or fourth chance at finding love, family, safety, and security. And, I'm not saying that sarcastically. I really think Melinda wants that - and confronting mental illness - to be Brian's legacy over the last 25 years as much as In The Key Of Disney. I don’t think Melinda had anything to do with the Disney album other than signing contracts. In 2009, Brian was without a record label, and he really wanted to work on a Gershwin Covers Album. So Disney agreed to sign him, if he provided them with the Gershwin covers Album as well as a Disney covers album. It’s that simple, it was just a contractual obligation. I wouldn’t be surprised to find out if it’s his lowest selling Album
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Post by bellesofparisstan on Apr 29, 2021 12:45:45 GMT
Apparently during the car interviews, Brian talked a lot about his brothers. It’s where the title comes from. So I really hope that they have a huge focus on that. He hasn’t much talked about Carl or Dennis in the last 20 years other than the occasional “ they had beautiful voices, dennis could write a hell of a tune, they died, I’m sad.”
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Post by Kapitan on Apr 29, 2021 12:46:17 GMT
I don’t think Melinda had anything to do with the Disney album other than signing contracts. In 2009, Brian was without a record label, and he really wanted to work on a Gershwin Covers Album. So Disney agreed to sign him, if he provided them with the Gershwin covers Album as well as a Disney covers album. It’s that simple, it was just a contractual obligation. I wouldn’t be surprised to find out if it’s his lowest selling AlbumI'm guessing that of the studio albums, that is very possible. Even GIOMH was at least in a relative high point of his career, coming out between his first tour of Smile shows and the BWPS album release. So there was a ton of press about him and it, relatively speaking. Plus, albums still sold more at that time than they did even those 6-7 years later.
Plus when Disney came out, it was his second consecutive covers album, he didn't tour it, and it seemed to get lost with the reunion talk (and the Smile Sessions).
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Post by Kapitan on Apr 29, 2021 12:48:53 GMT
Apparently during the car interviews, Brian talked a lot about his brothers. It’s where the title comes from. So I really hope that they have a huge focus on that. He hasn’t much talked about Carl or Dennis in the last 20 years other than the occasional “ they had beautiful voices, dennis could write a hell of a tune, they died, I’m sad.” I'd like that to be the case, but we'll see. My guess--just a guess--is it will mostly be the typical kind of content-less stuff. "They learned songs really fast," "Dennis really developed as a musician," "Carl learned to become a great producer," "they were very spiritual," "we used to sing together in the bedroom we shared." That kind of stuff.
I hope I'm wrong. It would be great to hear some new stories that seem like actual memories. It would be even more great to hear him talk about music. Really talk about music. Not "we wrote 'God Only Knows' in 10 minutes."
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Apr 29, 2021 16:45:42 GMT
I think had this film been released ten or twenty years ago this would've been true. But, now, with Brian pushing 80-years old, what is being promoted? I would expect Brian to perform some shows in the future but probably on a limited basis (at least I hope it's on a limited basis). So, in 2021-22, Brian Wilson doesn't need a vehicle to promote his touring. Is this film promoting his ongoing recording career? If Brian didn't compose a number of songs during this now 18-month pandemic (and if he did we probably would've heard about it), I'm not sure a recording career is something to promote either. That basically leaves his..."new" life...which has been the subject of numerous interviews, part of his book, and a movie. Again, employing total speculation, I wouldn't be surprised if the subjects of following his children's activities, walks/going to the deli, visits from old friends/musicians, watching TV, listening to music, and, yes, some tinkering in the studio are featured. THAT'S what can be promoted or celebrated, and basically was with the Love And Mercy film. Brian's second, or third, or fourth chance at finding love, family, safety, and security. And, I'm not saying that sarcastically. I really think Melinda wants that - and confronting mental illness - to be Brian's legacy over the last 25 years as much as In The Key Of Disney. I don’t think Melinda had anything to do with the Disney album other than signing contracts. In 2009, Brian was without a record label, and he really wanted to work on a Gershwin Covers Album. So Disney agreed to sign him, if he provided them with the Gershwin covers Album as well as a Disney covers album. It’s that simple, it was just a contractual obligation. I wouldn’t be surprised to find out if it’s his lowest selling Album I think Melinda's biggest influence or contribution(s) career-wise (and I don't want to get into the personal/family issues) is that she was gonna make sure that Brian a) released a steady flow of recordings, and that b) he was going to tour. Everybody has an opinion on how that worked out. Your mileage may vary. Was it good for Brian or was he...influenced...to release albums and perform concerts that were beneath his reputation, stature, and most importantly - wishes.
Again, if I may repeat, I think the "theme" of the film will be focused on how far Brian has come physically, emotionally, and professionally. They'll be sure to point out, especially with multiple interviews from guests, how "they" never thought they'd see Brian tour like he did, finish (ha ha) SMiLE, and just basically LIVE to this age (that's where his brothers come in). Yep, he made it! The long promised road. The family man. The live performer. The last surviving Wilson. Who'd a thunk it?
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Post by kds on Apr 29, 2021 17:12:15 GMT
I don’t think Melinda had anything to do with the Disney album other than signing contracts. In 2009, Brian was without a record label, and he really wanted to work on a Gershwin Covers Album. So Disney agreed to sign him, if he provided them with the Gershwin covers Album as well as a Disney covers album. It’s that simple, it was just a contractual obligation. I wouldn’t be surprised to find out if it’s his lowest selling Album I think Melinda's biggest influence or contribution(s) career-wise (and I don't want to get into the personal/family issues) is that she was gonna make sure that Brian a) released a steady flow of recordings, and that b) he was going to tour. Everybody has an opinion on how that worked out. Your mileage may vary. Was it good for Brian or was he...influenced...to release albums and perform concerts that were beneath his reputation, stature, and most importantly - wishes.
Again, if I may repeat, I think the "theme" of the film will be focused on how far Brian has come physically, emotionally, and professionally. They'll be sure to point out, especially with multiple interviews from guests, how "they" never thought they'd see Brian tour like he did, finish (ha ha) SMiLE, and just basically LIVE to this age (that's where his brothers come in). Yep, he made it! The long promised road. The family man. The live performer. The last surviving Wilson. Who'd a thunk it?
And none of us will ever really know Brian's true wishes in regards to how much he wants to work. I think it's a worthwhile story, which often is still to this day sprinkled with a healthy dose of myth, but between IJWMFTT, BW on Tour, Beautiful Dreamer, Love and Mercy, etc etc, I feel like it's been told so many times that I don't see Long Promised Road offering up anything really new.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2021 18:57:21 GMT
I am much more intrested in the collective sense of the entire beach boys survival rather than the fixation on their leader and original bassist.
I love everything about Brian but I have to agree that that story is already been told and already been in a movie and already been in a book and already been in a documentary and already been everywhere and even he had his f paper from Hawthorne high school turned into an a.
Much more excited about seeing The Beach Boys together for the 60th anniversary and focusing on their collective survival as a group and as performers and a song writers. Sometimes the love of Brian unfairly distinguishes him or separates him from the group as if he survived despite the pernicious influence of The Beach Boys.
Long live The Beach Boys and long live the great Brian Wilson.
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Post by Kapitan on Apr 29, 2021 19:00:22 GMT
What do you mean when you say you are interested in the survival of the Beach Boys? Do you mean their survival up to now, or going forward?
If up to now, do you think of what they've done as "survived?" I mean, the brand certainly has, but I think most would argue they haven't really survived in a true sense since Carl's death, approximately.
And if going forward ... I don't think reality will be kind to you. The 60th will come and go, and I think we're going to see them go their separate ways again pretty quickly.
Or do you mean neither, and more that you wish we were getting a doc about the band instead of Brian? (If that's the case, it's probably just a year or less away, as I'd guess the new one that's been discussed will be released to coincide with the 60th.)
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