sockit
The Surfer Moon
Posts: 234
Likes: 181
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Post by sockit on Sept 16, 2021 3:19:56 GMT
After much consideration and yada yada yada, here's what I came up with for what I would consider a strong 1971-ish album. And what the hell, let's call it LANDLOCKED:
Side One:
1. It's a New Day 2. San Miguel 3. Lady (Fallin' in Love) 4. Back Home 5. 4th of July 6. Big Sur
Side Two
7. Soulful Old Man Sunshine 8. Won't You Tell Me 9. Susie Cincinnati 10. Sound of Free 11. Sweet and Bitter 12. Wouldn't It Be Nice (to Live Again)
Wow! Just realized how Dennis-centric this set is. I suppose that says something....
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Post by Kapitan on Sept 26, 2021 15:19:13 GMT
As people incorporate unreleased songs into new albums, what stands out to you as the single most inexplicable song to be left unreleased at the time? And how "inexplicable" is it, really? Do you think it (and maybe some other top tunes left on the shelf) easily tops some of the songs that made albums? Or are they all of a piece, more or less, with one roughly as good as the others?
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Post by Kapitan on Sept 26, 2021 15:34:24 GMT
One other thing did come to mind the other day. When I was listening to a Brian May interview, he said that Freddie Mercury originally didn't want to do his song "Too Much Love Will Kill You" for Queen because it was cowritten by May and two other people, so his cut was going to be "a fourth of a third" (or something).
I have vague recollections--and I'm sorry, but I can't recall whether from this board, an article, or something else--of people suggesting that some of the tunes left off Sunflower and Surf's Up may have been omitted for similar reasons. "Soulful Old Man Sunshine," "Sweet and Bitter," "Seasons in the Sun," "Awake," "It's Natural" etc.
However, this doesn't seem like the most compelling argument in that a) plenty of songs that did make it had several non-Beach Boys as cowriters; and the band had both previously and soon after done full covers with no Beach Boys as writers.
Does anyone know whether that--not wanting to underpay themselves by allowing in outsiders' tunes or co-writes above their own songs--was documented as an issue at the time in determining track lists?
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Sept 26, 2021 16:03:57 GMT
Does anyone know whether that--not wanting to underpay themselves by allowing in outsiders' tunes or co-writes above their own songs--was documented as an issue at the time in determining track lists? I really don't know but it wouldn't surprise me. Money ruled this band, albeit moreso later in their career.
I wonder how much the record companies had to do with the final track lists. Weren't they rejecting, tweaking, and influencing several BB albums from Sunflower to the present?
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Sept 26, 2021 16:13:52 GMT
As people incorporate unreleased songs into new albums, what stands out to you as the single most inexplicable song to be left unreleased at the time? And how "inexplicable" is it, really? Do you think it (and maybe some other top tunes left on the shelf) easily tops some of the songs that made albums? Or are they all of a piece, more or less, with one roughly as good as the others? That part hasn't changed much for me since I've listened to the set. It's still the omission of Dennis's songs from Surf's Up - "Lady", "4th Of July", and "(Wouldn't It Be Nice) To Live Again". Those songs would've elevated the Surf's Up album from good/very good to great status, and it would've leapfrogged some BB albums on my favorite BB albums list.
A few others? "Soulful Old Man Sunshine". I think "Seasons In The Sun" is an excellent song but The Beach Boys didn't quite pull it off. Maybe a finished "It's Natural". Possibly "Sweet And Bitter". I would've liked more Mike Love vocals on Sunflower and Surf's Up.
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sockit
The Surfer Moon
Posts: 234
Likes: 181
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Post by sockit on Sept 26, 2021 20:43:12 GMT
As people incorporate unreleased songs into new albums, what stands out to you as the single most inexplicable song to be left unreleased at the time? And how "inexplicable" is it, really? Do you think it (and maybe some other top tunes left on the shelf) easily tops some of the songs that made albums? Or are they all of a piece, more or less, with one roughly as good as the others? Any... ANY of the unreleased songs would have been better than the likes of "Take a Load Off Your Feet". When I put in my "surround" SACD of Surf's Up I can tolerate "Don't Go Near the Water" (even though you all know I hate it), then we go on to "Long Promised Road" which is excellent. Then I only have to hear the first few notes of "Take a Load Off" and I am scrambling for the remote. And ya know what? I have defended "Student Demonstration Time" a number of times in the past, but its absence wouldn't break my heart. And I'm sure a number of other folks wouldn't have missed it. Sure, any of these unreleased tunes would have worked just as well. And what about the fact that the track count on SU is down by two, compared to Sunflower? I'm not sure what the running times are, but I'm sure that two of these buried gems would have fit.
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Post by Kapitan on Sept 26, 2021 21:17:38 GMT
I'm probably the world's biggest "Feet" apologist, so despite standing alone to die on this hill (or is it a crater?), I'm not budging.
But as for running times: Sunflower was 36:55, and Surf's Up was 33:49. There's room.
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sockit
The Surfer Moon
Posts: 234
Likes: 181
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Post by sockit on Nov 7, 2021 15:57:21 GMT
I'm bumping up this thread to announce that I'm zeroing in on my outtake album(s) and will have a final lineup to list very soon. This has actually developed into quite a project for me, as I've spent a considerable amount of time in my studio EQing and doing some minor editing on some of the tracks (no disrespect to Mr. Linett, I'm just very picky on mastering).
My list will be similar to what I listed in my earlier post, except that now that I have acquired the actual 5 disc set, I've made several more discoveries. My project has evolved into 2 albums, which I've tentatively designated as The Fading Rock Group Revival (fictitiously released as a follow up to the very real Sunflower in late 1970, just in time for Christmas) and then Landlocked (released in 1971 in place of Surf's Up).
Yeah, I'm totally messing with history but my goal is to assemble two very listenable theoretical albums from this incredible era.
Stay tuned.....
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sockit
The Surfer Moon
Posts: 234
Likes: 181
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Post by sockit on Nov 14, 2021 16:36:51 GMT
Well I've completed my project and I have locked in my fantasy 1970-71 Beach Boys twofer. As I stated in my previous post I am focusing more on what hangs together as album lineups (for my personal taste anyway), then strict chronology. I'm sure every aspect of this project is debatable, right down to my choice of album titles, but in the end it's just for fun.
I'm going to post only the first "album" for now, which in this alternate universe could have been released a few months after the excellent SUNFLOWER (which we'll assume was widely received and did incredibly well in sales!)
THE FADING ROCK GROUP REVIVAL (late 1970)
Side One
1. Soulful Old Man Sunshine As I've stated before, this tune has almost a Motown sound to it. Very 1969-70 sounding. I think it makes a perfect lead off to this album and could've easily been a single. My edit is similar to the homemade YouTube video someone created awhile back. I used the slow intro from the Endless Harmony cd version and then the verses from the Feel Flows track. I also used the EH version for the group tags, eliminating Carl's out of synch lead in those parts. And then once again like the video, I finished up with the EH track with its layers of backing vocals, sadly missing on the FF mix. Then I applied a bit of EQ to the whole track to tame the somewhat shrill highs.
2. San Miguel I went with the FF version of course, as it has way more of a stereo spread to it. I EQed the lows to take some of the boomy-ness out of it, and adjusted the volume. Sequencing this right after SOMS gives this album a strong one-two punch. Another potential single (a or b-side).
3. Won't You Tell Me I know this wasn't recorded until the Surf's Up era, but to me it has such a 1969-70 vibe it just feels more at home with these earlier tunes. By 1971 the style seemed to be changing, with more synth and a more progressive sound.
4. Sound of Free Ok, time to get a Dennis lead in there! Not much I can comment on with this song; it's just a great rockin' tune. I just wish there was a stereo mix to put here.
5. Cotton Fields Continuing a very strong Side One of this album with an offering from Al. I utilized the Hawthorne mix because the odd synching on the intro of the FF version just doesn't work for me. Also, there seems to be a bit more of a stereo spread on the older mix.
6. I'm Going Your Way The last track on Side One keeps the momentum going with this soulful Dennis rocker. I trimmed the chatter off the beginning, as humorous as it is.
Side Two
1. Loop De Loop Side Two kicks off with what I interpret as a "vintage sounding novelty tune". On this one I again mined the EH soundtrack for the mix I prefer (even if it wasn't the "original" mix). There's just something about Al's falsetto in the vintage mix that doesn't set right with me.
2. Carnival (Over the Waves) Since this track has a similar vibe to Loop De Loop, I have cross faded it onto the ending. This has created sort of a mini-suite on this part of the album, and I don't know if there was ever was a concept to do that or something similar, but I'm taking a liberty here once again just for fun.
3. When Girls Get Together This song continues the mini-suite, as it has a similar vintage sounding vibe to the previous two songs. I didn't cross fade this one with Carnival because it just didn't sound right to me.
4. My Solution Completes the mini-suite with this darkly humorous tune that reminds me of the old classic black and white horror movies. I know it wasn't intended to be on an album, but I had to put it somewhere! I trimmed Brian's "play it!" off the end because I like the idea of fading out with his maniacal laughter.
5. Susie Cincinnati Back on track with the classic Beach Boys rock sound. I used the FF mix which seems to be the most satisfying to me.
6. Lady (Fallin' in Love) As the album starts to wind down, one of the few mellow songs on the set.
7. Back Home This seems to be a good way to end the album. A song that has its roots in the earlier classic era of the Beach Boys with a bit of a nostalgic sound. I trimmed off the false start.
Well there's the first half. I will post my 1971 album lineup soon...
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Nov 15, 2021 11:19:07 GMT
Good work, sockit. The album echoes the title -The Fading Rock Group Revival - it ROCKS more than Sunflower and Surf's Up combined! You got guts ("When Girls Get Together" ), but I wonder what this guy would think?
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sockit
The Surfer Moon
Posts: 234
Likes: 181
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Post by sockit on Nov 15, 2021 22:01:11 GMT
Good work, sockit. The album echoes the title -The Fading Rock Group Revival - it ROCKS more than Sunflower and Surf's Up combined! You got guts ("When Girls Get Together" ), but I wonder what this guy would think? Thanks, SJS! I like that title because I think it sounds very much of the times. I picture the cover having a rather organic sort of home grown look. Something along the lines of SUNFLOWER but perhaps with a more vintage/historical looking photo of the band. Something like CSNY's Déjà Vu. In fact, I think I saw a fan-created mock up of such a cover posted some years ago. It took awhile for "When Girls Get Together" to grow on me. I initially disliked it because the lyrics are just so awkward (not to mention the subject matter!). And the whole song seems a tad repetitious (I don't think I could tolerate it running any longer than it does). But now I find it rather catchy and the instrumentation is quite enjoyable, and amazing in parts. I love that ascending scale in the ritardando parts, on the Celeste or Moog, or whatever it is (can somebody please help me out on that one?).
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Post by Kapitan on Nov 15, 2021 22:21:09 GMT
I love that ascending scale in the ritardando parts, on the Celeste or Moog, or whatever it is (can somebody please help me out on that one?). Is this the part you mean? (Cued up.)
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sockit
The Surfer Moon
Posts: 234
Likes: 181
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Post by sockit on Nov 15, 2021 23:16:47 GMT
I love that ascending scale in the ritardando parts, on the Celeste or Moog, or whatever it is (can somebody please help me out on that one?). Is this the part you mean? (Cued up.)
Yes.
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Post by Kapitan on Nov 15, 2021 23:24:37 GMT
My first thought was, it sounds like an electric piano of some sort.
But it also almost sounds like a (relatively bad?) synthesized version of a harp.
I don't think it's a celeste--though I have to admit I think of the higher register of a celeste (e.g. Tchaikovsky's Dance of the Sugar Plum Fairies in the Nutcracker Suite), so maybe its lower register would sound like that.
Congrats making me confuse myself on a part that I admit I'd never given a second thought to before.
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sockit
The Surfer Moon
Posts: 234
Likes: 181
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Post by sockit on Nov 20, 2021 21:19:07 GMT
As promised, here is the second half of my cd-r twofer. I'm gonna say right off that this installment is likely to be controversial. In fact, I can think of one or two other forums where I'd be likely tarred and feathered! Just remember, this is just my personal alternate universe based on opinion and taste, and I certainly welcome other folks' take on this little exercise.
As y'all know, I'm not a huge fan of the Surf's Up album. IMO, there's a few great tracks on there and some not so great. I've mashed up my favorites with a number of the unreleased tracks from that year. In my fantasy world, the SMiLE album was released on schedule in 1967, and while we can debate till the end of time whether that album could've made a big splash, I like to think that the song "Surf's Up" was somewhat of a hit in that time period (or at least a cult classic). With that idea in mind, the song's inclusion on a 1971 album becomes unnecessary. So I'm calling my 1971 reimagining Landlocked.
LANDLOCKED (1971)
Side One
1. It's a New Day Once again, a perfect leadoff to an album. A catchy, rocking song with a positive message. And what a great way to introduce new member Blondie. Gone is "Don't Go Near the Water" which I kind of despise. Use that song for a TV psa or something....
2. Long Promised Road Let's keep this one in the second slot. It's a soulful rocker and still has positive lyrics. I really had to tinker with the EQ on this one. The SACD is very toned down on highs, while the FF track seems to overcompensate with ear splitting shrillness. I was able to take that one and shave back some of those highs.
3. Big Sur My favorite version of "Big Sur" by far, and a nice gentle break after the one-two punch of rockers. It's nice to hear more Mike on this set. He (like the other Beach Boys in their own way) had shining moments as a lead singer.
4. 4th of July Ok, being the fourth track is purely coincidental! I just noticed that oddity! But I feel like this majestic track belongs here. I had to tame the lows a bit. When those drums come in, things around the house--and my car--rattle, and not in a good way.
5. Sweet and Bitter Another stellar lead by Mike. Is it just me, or does Mike sound a lot like Al here? I realize this track isn't exactly finished but it stands up pretty well. Obviously this set is dominated by mellow songs, but I guess that's where things were at overall.
6. Lookin' At Tomorrow This is the FF version without the phasey effects and the piercing "Ba ba bahh" part toward the end. I trimmed off the chatter and false start at the beginning. I think this makes a better side one closer than "Student Demonstration Time". I know, I used to defend that song quite a bit, but I've grown tired of it. GONE!
Side Two
1. Seasons in the Sun I don't know if this could've been a single for the Boys or not, it's all debatable. Terry Jacks' hit single from '74 will always be THE version. Still, this is a nice vocal from Carl and leading off the side with it seems logical.
2. It's Natural Another nice vocal from Mike. I know this track is very incomplete, but I polished it up a little by reprising the one and only verse at the end.
3. Til I Die What can I say? Arguably the bestest song from Surf's Up absolutely has to be on here!
4. Old Movie Even though this became "Cuddle Up" on the next album, it sounds great as an instrumental with that incredible flute part.
5. Feel Flows Goes without saying....
6. (Wouldn't it be Nice To) Live Again A perfect closer, to me, with it's cool jazzy instrumental jam at the end.
And there it is. I'm ducking for cover now!
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