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Post by B.E. on Oct 8, 2020 19:20:57 GMT
Anyone else notice this flag fetish during this era? Have any other examples? James Taylor - Flag, 1979 Neil Young - Hawks & Doves, 1980 Neil Young - Re-ac-tor, 1981 Van Halen - Diver Down, 1982
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Post by Kapitan on Oct 8, 2020 20:13:21 GMT
Here's a feature on Eddie and the band's legacy from a publication that doesn't exactly champion their kind of music. (It is predictably mixed, giving plenty of credit but also throwing some shade.)
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Post by B.E. on Oct 8, 2020 21:29:56 GMT
I'm really enjoying Diver Down! So nice, listening to it twice. I'm definitely picking up a copy for the collection, and for cruisin'. I might even prefer this to the debut! More later.
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Post by B.E. on Oct 8, 2020 22:36:42 GMT
I'm really enjoying Driver Down! So nice, listening to it twice. I'm definitely picking up a copy for the collection, and for cruisin'. I might even prefer this to the debut! More later. Huh, funny, I had referred to Diver Down as Driver Down in my last two posts - I think I was already envisioning driving to it. Anyway, I wanted to listen to it twice in order to figure out what I prefer about this album. I think part of it is that they slowed down the tempo a bit. It's more straightforward rock, I think. But, it's still a serious toe-tapper of an album! I think this allows me to savor the guitar solos more and, whether or not there's a connection, I think it opens up Roth to sing in different styles. I found his singing to be the best on this album, and it's not close. More restrained, and tasteful. But, still powerful. Great singing. Surprisingly, I don't think he screech-squeals until the second to last song! And, he nails it. It's welcomed. The album is more varied. Part of that is the mixture of originals with covers, but it really feels purposeful. "Cathedral" is a fantastic instrumental. I'd never think that was VH if I heard it in passing. The other two instruments couldn't be more different, stylistically, from the subsequent songs, but at least in the case of "Intruder" the transition is seamless. The closer, "Happy Trails", is fun as hell, but not entirely out of left field as we previously had the vocal break in "I'm The One" and "Could This Be Magic?" (by the way, I read that Nicolette Larson sings on that one. I liked her work with Neil Young). Also in that vein is "Big Bad Bill" which I think lands perfectly well. This is a fun, eclectic album. I also like how "The Full Bug" opens as an acoustic blues piece before electrifying. I literally like every song on this album. "Secrets" is pretty, but so is "Little Guitars" for a rocker. Both of those knocked me out. I like that side of VH. The more I listen to the latter, the more impressed I am. Initially, I agreed with you guys about "Dancing In The Street" but after listening a few more times the funkiness of that backing track won me over (no easy task). And, there's an example of a guitar solo being able to breathe and is all the better for it. Love that tone and performance. In addition to Roth's great, varied lead vocals, there's a lot more background vocals on this album - which I like a lot. A lot more oohs and aahs. It's unifying. This album doesn't have the hits that some of the others have, but it's the most consistent listen for me. I didn't even mention some of my favorite songs...they're all good! 8/10
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Oct 8, 2020 23:35:58 GMT
This is a very good interview with Eddie. Eddie says a few things that are sadly poignant in light of his passing:
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Post by Kapitan on Oct 9, 2020 0:11:45 GMT
In addition to Roth's great, varied lead vocals, there's a lot more background vocals on this album - which I like a lot. A lot more oohs and aahs. It's unifying. I agree 100% with this.
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Post by kds on Oct 9, 2020 12:08:05 GMT
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Post by kds on Oct 9, 2020 12:22:06 GMT
5150 (1986)
In 1984, Van Halen were the biggest band in the world, but they couldn't keep it together. David Lee Roth seemed more interested in launching a solo career, and recorded a cover of California Girls before parting ways with Van Halen.
So, how does the biggest band in the world replace a charismatic frontman? Well, after considering Patti Smith of Scandal, they looked backwards. Before recording their debut album, producer Ted Templeman recommended the former lead singer of Montrose, a band whose debut album he produced a few years prior. The singer was Sammy Hagar.
Hagar had a nice little solo career going when he joined up with Van Halen, in what might be the most polarizing personnel change in rock history.
But, just as the album 1984 gets maligned by some fans for being "pop," so does the debut of "Van Hagar." Much like 1984, some of 5150's most popular songs were synth based, but it's still a very guitar oriented album, and in my very 'umble opinion, the band's best since Van Halen I.
I grew up in the 1980s, so I don't think that synths are some sin against all things rawk. Ronnie James Dio himself had some great synth riffs on his albums. Why not Van Halen? Why Can't This Be Love, the first single from Van Halen Mk. 2, was a massive hit, and for good reason, it's got a great hook and great vocals. Even those in Camp David (Lee Roth) will argue that Sammy is far and away the better singer. There's also VH's first true ballad, Love Walks In. Frankly, I like hearing Eddie play a little more restrained solo here. Not everything has to evoke Eruption. One the other synth based track is one of VH's best songs from either era, Dreams.
You want some good old fashioned Van Halen face melters? Good Enough ang Get Up, which brilliantly bookend Why Can't This Be Love. Some more melodic rock? Summer Nights, Best of Both Worlds, and the title track.
The one blip to me is the closer Inside. You ever wonder what it would sound like if you put The Beach Boys talk tracks to music? Okay, maybe it's not that bad, but the album could've ended with 5150, and it would've been fine.
Either way, this is IMO Van Halen's 2nd best LP, and I'll give it a nine.
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Post by Kapitan on Oct 9, 2020 12:35:50 GMT
I agree with almost every word of that. In many ways this is my first real Van Halen album from real time: I had heard the 1984 hits but (as an 8-9 year old) didn't own the album or give it regular listens. With 5150, I did. So a lot of those songs I identify with very deeply as classics--even the ones that aren't otherwise considered as such. "Summer Nights," "Dreams," "Why Can't This Be Love," and "Love Walks In" are especially fantastic.
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Post by kds on Oct 9, 2020 15:42:23 GMT
5150 was actually my first VH album. I'd always known VH from the radio growing up, but I really didn't start collecting CDs until I was 15, and I got a copy of 5150 for Christmas in 1995. I played that CD so much, I'm surprised it still works.
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Post by kds on Oct 9, 2020 16:17:04 GMT
OU812 (1988)
Van Halen's eight album shows Eddie showing even more of a preference for keyboards than the previous two albums. It's also the first Van Halen album that I feel could be a little shorter.
OU812 finds Van Halen exploring some different styles, and even feels AOR in places, many of which are interesting, and IMO better than some of the albums rockers. The opener Mine All Mine featuring a thumping synth that drives the song, although this is the first of a couple songs that has a little too long of a run time.
When Sammy joined the band, the songs did get a little longer, but I think the songs on 5150 warranted their lengths. That's not really the case for me on OU812. In addition to Mine All Mine, I think Cabo Wabo could've been trimmed considerably. There's just not enough interesting things on that song to warrant seven minutes. I think Black and Blue meanders a bit also.
Two of my favorites on the album, which went on to become relatively popular, are each a long way from the type of OTT bombast Van Halen is known for, and I can see how some fans of the DLR era might be turned off by them. Finish What Ya Started is an all acoustic song, but I love the chorus and the backing vox. Feels So Good continues where Love Walks In started, but is even more light. But, again, great vocals by Sammy, and a great solo by Eddie. Apparently, a version exists of Eddie playing the synth part on a Hammond organ. I hope that's one of the treasures the Alex and Wolfe find in the vaults.
AFU, Sucker in a Three Piece, and Source of Infection are pretty good, but I never really listen to them away from the album. Again, a weak closer, as the cover of Little Feat's Apolitical Blues is probably my least favorite VH cover (even more so than Big Bad Bill).
So, the album is kind of middling, but still pleasant. However, it does include an all time (for me anyway) - When It's Love. A near perfect power ballad for the late 1980s, and in my top three VH songs of all time, maybe my favorite. The closing na-na-na's from the band repeating the opening synth riff is incredible.
As a listening experience, I probably have to give OU812 a 7. Overall, it's pleasant, with nothing really terrible (with the possible exception of the closer). One great songs, some very good ones, and a lot of good to alright.
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Post by B.E. on Oct 9, 2020 18:13:47 GMT
1984 (1984)As noted earlier, some Van Halen fans say 1984 is "too poppy," but as noted Van Halen had always had a little pop influence on their guitar heavy attack. The truth is that the 1984 album is just as guitar heavy as any Van Halen offering. Drop Dead Legs, Top Jimmy, and House of Pain are what anyone would expect or want from a Van Halen record. Panama and Hot For Teacher both became huge songs, and feature all sorts of riffs and Eddie wizardry. I guess the two "offenders" are Jump and I'll Wait, each of which are bathed in synths. But, they're both great songs, and both feature great guitar solos from Eddie. To me, the only negative I can really say about 1984 is that I've just heard Jump, Panama, and Hot for Teacher too many times. While "Jump" and "I'll Wait" are probably their most poppy songs to-date, I really don't think that's saying much. In other words, they aren't that far removed from the rest of their work (particularly the hits). What I think might push some fans over the edge is the addition of the synths. There's no subtlety there whatsoever. I think that combination, that sound, is just too un-VH for them, too contemporary. I actually think both songs work quite well (although, the synth workout after the guitar solo in "Jump" is really pushing it). Oh, and there's also the synth instrumental opener "1984" painting the record into a corner, but I agree the rest of the album sounds like classic VH. I'd add "Girl Gone Bad" to the 'everything you'd want from VH' and 'Eddie wizardry' folders, as well. That one takes a little while to build up, but it's ultimately relentless. My personal favorites are the hits. "Drop Dead Legs" and "I'll Wait" were tops of the rest. 7/10 Edit: I didn't realize "I'll Wait" was a hit. I was referring to "Panama", "Hot For Teacher", and "Jump" as my favorites.
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Post by B.E. on Oct 9, 2020 18:14:08 GMT
1984 (1984)Unfortunately, it would be the final full album from the original band as the dreaded "artistic differences" were rearing their ugly head. Forgive me if you broached the topic in another post, but what's the general fan consensus on the various eras? What are the narratives?
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Post by kds on Oct 9, 2020 18:23:42 GMT
1984 (1984)Unfortunately, it would be the final full album from the original band as the dreaded "artistic differences" were rearing their ugly head. Forgive me if you broached the topic in another post, but what's the general fan consensus on the various eras? What are the narratives? Most VH fans seem to gravitate to the DLR era (although the numbers show that the Hagar version of the band had a ton of fans too). The reason that I hear the most, which irks me to no end, is "Sammy made Van Halen a pop band." That argument makes no sense to me as they had just as many pop moments with DLR. And, and I'll mention when we get into 1990s Van Halen, some of their heaviest, and non pop-like material featured Sammy on vocals.
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Post by B.E. on Oct 9, 2020 21:41:31 GMT
5150
I was curious how I'd feel about the Hager era, or if I'd even recognize it, and the results aren't great. I'd definitely heard that "Why Can't This Be Love" hook, but I surely never thought it was Van Halen! The chorus melody of "Love Walks In" is pretty irresistible, both good songs, but I'm having a little trouble reconciling them with the image and sound of the DLR era. (Obviously, I'm just a casual fan, so take that for what it's worth.) The highlights for me were actually "Best of Both Worlds" and "5150" but neither matched the highs of their previous albums (except Fair Warnings, possibly). "Dreams" sounds more like Journey and the refrain of "Summer Nights" woulda been a great Eagles song. "Get Up" and "Inside" are my least favorite non-instrumental VH songs to-date. As for Hager, he's obviously very talented but I prefer Roth's voice and style. I'm not hopeful for the Hager era, but I'll probably stick around since I made it this far and I'm curious about Van Halen III and the DLR reunion.
5/10
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