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Post by kds on Nov 19, 2019 19:25:21 GMT
He's done it before. And I think Sail Away is one of the most Beach Boys esque songs in his solo catalog (having Al and Blondie on vocals helps). I get that. But, the question isn't really if it could fit in, but if it's an equal - if it's deserving of being performed an equal amount of times. Edit: kds , to be clear, I'd include a song like "Sail Away" in my short list of songs to rotate in and out of his setlist. I just think songs like "Sloop" are still better and, in this case, they are too similar to play together if our goal is to create the best possible setlist. Well, to be fair, I don't think Brian has a single solo song that I'd call "equal" to his Beach Boys prime. But, I think if Brian or whoever decided to include songs from his solo career, I actually think Sail Away would be a good fit, and I think it sounded fine as part of the Blondie set during some of the PS shows in 2016.
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Post by B.E. on Nov 19, 2019 19:47:11 GMT
Brian's known for his '60s songwriting and production. Those songs, those arrangements. Maybe if he were a renowned performer, he could get away with more eclectic setlists because the emphasis would be more equally shared between song and performance. Of course, that's not Brian. I think that's a major factor.
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Post by kds on Nov 19, 2019 19:49:33 GMT
Brian's known for his '60s songwriting and production. Those songs, those arrangements. Maybe if he were a renowned performer, he could get away with more eclectic setlists, because the emphasis would be more equally shared between song and performance. Of course, that's not Brian. I think that's a major factor. That could be a factor, but I honestly don't think it's nearly as much as a factor as the fact that his solo career didn't really yield any major hits.
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Post by B.E. on Nov 19, 2019 19:59:20 GMT
Brian's known for his '60s songwriting and production. Those songs, those arrangements. Maybe if he were a renowned performer, he could get away with more eclectic setlists, because the emphasis would be more equally shared between song and performance. Of course, that's not Brian. I think that's a major factor. That could be a factor, but I honestly don't think it's nearly as much as a factor as the fact that his solo career didn't really yield any major hits. Two not entirely unrelated things. Brian was a much better performer in the '60s. I don't think you can overstate how crucial Brian's falsetto was to the Beach Boys success.
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Post by kds on Nov 19, 2019 20:04:56 GMT
That could be a factor, but I honestly don't think it's nearly as much as a factor as the fact that his solo career didn't really yield any major hits. Two not entirely unrelated things. Brian was a much better performer in the '60s. I don't think you can overstate how crucial Brian's falsetto was to the Beach Boys success. That's true, but I'm not certain how it ties into Brian Wilson as a live act over the last 20 years since that falsetto is long long gone.
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Post by lonelysummer on Nov 20, 2019 6:05:11 GMT
As much as I do not especially care for the majority of Brian's solo records (was that politically correct enough? ), I still think about 6-7 songs should/could be included in his sets - and be concert staples. And I say that for a few reasons. You are going to see Brian Wilson the solo artist and I don't think that has to be a technicality. For whatever reason(s), Brian has been a solo artist for 35 years, almost twice as long as he has been a Beach Boy. As a solo artist, he has recorded X amount of songs and released X amount of solo albums, maybe more than he actually wrote/produced as a Beach Boy. I just think it would be normal(?) or expected or logical to represent those 35 years more prominently. I don't think there would be anything wrong with saying, "In 1988 I did my first solo album and here's a song from that album, "Love And Mercy"...", or "There's an album I really like called That Lucky Old Sun and here's my favorite song from that album, "Midnight's Another Day"...", or "Here's a song from my last album, No Pier Pressure. The song was also featured in the movie, Love And Mercy. It's called "One Kind Of Love"...".
If Brian did highlight more of his solo career, I really don't think he would be risking alienating his audience. Actually, I think the audience would eat that up. Let's be honest, a large percentage of the audience attending Brian's concerts are diehards. And a large percentage has attended numerous Beach Boys' concerts and heard those BB songs performed live numerous times. A typical BW solo concert has, what, 25-30 songs? Even if Brian performed 6-7 songs (or one from each studio solo album), that still leaves enough room for the Beach Boys' classics.
The problem is, first, I don't think Brian is especially fond of his solo work (just my opinion), and second, he probably doesn't want to work that hard (learning new songs) when he can go on auto-pilot with the always familiar BB songs.
i honestly thought One Kind of Love would join Love and Mercy as a concert staple - IIRC, the backstory on the song was that it was for Melinda, the love of his life, the woman who saved him. Really, what Brian and Al are doing now is a Beach Boys in all but name. I could easily name half a dozen post-BB's songs that Brian should be doing live - Melt Away, Let it Shine, Rio Grande, South American, Lay Down Burden, Midnight's Another Day; and with Al seemingly a permanent part of the touring band, why not have him do a couple Postcard songs?
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Post by lonelysummer on Nov 20, 2019 6:07:16 GMT
In regard to touring, has anything really changed? Artists, generally, promote current releases and perform fan favorites. NPP is a particularly odd choice to criticize. Brian promoted it on tour. He performed songs from it. He named the tour after it. He even released a live album and DVD which included "This Beautiful Day", "Runaway Dancer", "On The Island", "Half Moon Bay", "The Right Time", "Sail Away", and "Saturday Night". Artists don't promote albums indefinitely. If a fan favorite emerges, it tends to stick around. Fair or not, late career material has little chance of making that type of impact. It's fighting cherished memories and close-mindedness. I view touring classic albums (in full or not) as a combination of promoting current releases and performing fan favorites, as there is typically an anniversary re-release of some sort available for purchase. They work as a substitute for new material which most legacy artists struggle to come up with. As for Neil Young, he's one of the few who keeps creating. He's always got a new album out, and, yes, he performs his new material live in order to promote them. But, he doesn't perform "new" material from 4 years ago as some think Brian should be. The issue isn't that artists don't care about their recent studio work, it's that the fans don't. (A few dozen fans on internet message boards aside.) I'm listening to Neil Young, I gotta turn up the sound Someone's always saying, turn it down
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Nov 20, 2019 12:57:09 GMT
As much as I do not especially care for the majority of Brian's solo records (was that politically correct enough? ), I still think about 6-7 songs should/could be included in his sets - and be concert staples. And I say that for a few reasons. You are going to see Brian Wilson the solo artist and I don't think that has to be a technicality. For whatever reason(s), Brian has been a solo artist for 35 years, almost twice as long as he has been a Beach Boy. As a solo artist, he has recorded X amount of songs and released X amount of solo albums, maybe more than he actually wrote/produced as a Beach Boy. I just think it would be normal(?) or expected or logical to represent those 35 years more prominently. I don't think there would be anything wrong with saying, "In 1988 I did my first solo album and here's a song from that album, "Love And Mercy"...", or "There's an album I really like called That Lucky Old Sun and here's my favorite song from that album, "Midnight's Another Day"...", or "Here's a song from my last album, No Pier Pressure. The song was also featured in the movie, Love And Mercy. It's called "One Kind Of Love"...".
If Brian did highlight more of his solo career, I really don't think he would be risking alienating his audience. Actually, I think the audience would eat that up. Let's be honest, a large percentage of the audience attending Brian's concerts are diehards. And a large percentage has attended numerous Beach Boys' concerts and heard those BB songs performed live numerous times. A typical BW solo concert has, what, 25-30 songs? Even if Brian performed 6-7 songs (or one from each studio solo album), that still leaves enough room for the Beach Boys' classics.
The problem is, first, I don't think Brian is especially fond of his solo work (just my opinion), and second, he probably doesn't want to work that hard (learning new songs) when he can go on auto-pilot with the always familiar BB songs.
i honestly thought One Kind of Love would join Love and Mercy as a concert staple - IIRC, the backstory on the song was that it was for Melinda, the love of his life, the woman who saved him. Really, what Brian and Al are doing now is a Beach Boys in all but name. I could easily name half a dozen post-BB's songs that Brian should be doing live - Melt Away, Let it Shine, Rio Grande, South American, Lay Down Burden, Midnight's Another Day; and with Al seemingly a permanent part of the touring band, why not have him do a couple Postcard songs? I agree. There's so much more the Brian, Al & Blondie show could be doing including a short Al set - either before Brian comes on or mid-way through. I guess they are kind of doing that with Blondie with his two or three songs. The Brian Wilson show has stretched out a little bit recently with the Friends, Wild Honey, and Surf's Up stuff, but you still have to think Brian could insert SOME solo songs into the setlist.
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Post by kds on Nov 20, 2019 13:25:07 GMT
As much as I do not especially care for the majority of Brian's solo records (was that politically correct enough? ), I still think about 6-7 songs should/could be included in his sets - and be concert staples. And I say that for a few reasons. You are going to see Brian Wilson the solo artist and I don't think that has to be a technicality. For whatever reason(s), Brian has been a solo artist for 35 years, almost twice as long as he has been a Beach Boy. As a solo artist, he has recorded X amount of songs and released X amount of solo albums, maybe more than he actually wrote/produced as a Beach Boy. I just think it would be normal(?) or expected or logical to represent those 35 years more prominently. I don't think there would be anything wrong with saying, "In 1988 I did my first solo album and here's a song from that album, "Love And Mercy"...", or "There's an album I really like called That Lucky Old Sun and here's my favorite song from that album, "Midnight's Another Day"...", or "Here's a song from my last album, No Pier Pressure. The song was also featured in the movie, Love And Mercy. It's called "One Kind Of Love"...".
If Brian did highlight more of his solo career, I really don't think he would be risking alienating his audience. Actually, I think the audience would eat that up. Let's be honest, a large percentage of the audience attending Brian's concerts are diehards. And a large percentage has attended numerous Beach Boys' concerts and heard those BB songs performed live numerous times. A typical BW solo concert has, what, 25-30 songs? Even if Brian performed 6-7 songs (or one from each studio solo album), that still leaves enough room for the Beach Boys' classics.
The problem is, first, I don't think Brian is especially fond of his solo work (just my opinion), and second, he probably doesn't want to work that hard (learning new songs) when he can go on auto-pilot with the always familiar BB songs.
i honestly thought One Kind of Love would join Love and Mercy as a concert staple - IIRC, the backstory on the song was that it was for Melinda, the love of his life, the woman who saved him. Really, what Brian and Al are doing now is a Beach Boys in all but name. I could easily name half a dozen post-BB's songs that Brian should be doing live - Melt Away, Let it Shine, Rio Grande, South American, Lay Down Burden, Midnight's Another Day; and with Al seemingly a permanent part of the touring band, why not have him do a couple Postcard songs? I'd actually love to hear a live version of Postcard's title track with Brian's band, and Blondie singing Glenn Campbell's lines.
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Post by Kapitan on Nov 20, 2019 13:38:32 GMT
I realized I forgot to weigh in on what Brian Wilson solo songs are on par with his classic material, songs that could truly stand alongside his best work in live shows. If we’re talking the best of his best, zero. There isn’t a “Good Vibrations,” a “Wouldn’t It Be Nice,” or a “God Only Knows” in the bunch. But I like plenty of his solo material, and I do think he has several songs that are second- or third-tier. Here is a September “hits show” setlist from setlist.fm: California Girls Dance, Dance, Dance I Get Around Shut Down Little Deuce Coupe 409 In My Room Surfer Girl Salt Lake City Wake the World Add Some Music To Your Day Don’t Worry Baby Darlin Feel Flows Wild Honey Sail On, Sailor Do It Again I Can Hear Music Wouldn’t It Be Nice Sloop John B God Only Knows Good Vibrations Help Me, Rhonda Barbara Ann Surfin USA Fun Fun Fun Love & Mercy For me, you could certainly find replacements for Shut Down, 409, Salt Lake City, I Can Hear Music, and Barbara Ann without many people being especially upset. (My own personal taste would actually also omit all three Blondie-sung songs, Do It Again, and Surfin USA.) Let’s split the difference and try to find six Brian Wilson solo songs to add to that set list. Melt Away, Your Imagination, Lay Down Burden, How Could We Still Be Dancin?, Getting In Over My Head, Desert Drive, City Blues, Morning Beat, Good Kind of Love, California Role, Oxygen to the Brain, Midnight’s Another Day, Goin’ Home, Saturday Night on Hollywood Boulevard, One Kind of Love, and Tell Me Why all are as good as the lesser material his band plays live now. In addition to more casual fans not knowing these songs for the most part, there are a few challenges. The best of his solo songs tend to be ballads, and even a Brian Wilson show (with, let’s be honest, older and/or somewhat sedated fans) can’t be ALL ballads. The bigger challenge is, he can’t sing a lot of his songs, whether for range issues or his enunciation problems or his inability to remember/track lyrics. Sorry, that was long. Summary: none of his solo songs are as good as his top-notch Beach Boys songs, but he often already plays lesser Beach Boys songs. That being the case, there could easily be half a dozen or so solo songs incorporated into the set, even though they aren’t as good as his best.
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Nov 20, 2019 13:58:28 GMT
I would keep the Blondie songs/mini-set. While Brian doesn't appear to be overly enamored while Blondie is performing (or any other part of the concert for that matter), Blondie infuses much-needed energy, yes musicianship, and a different "feel" if you know what I mean. That rock music - and that's what it is - works IMO.
This isn't a knock at Mike Love or his contributions to the group, but I would cut back on the BB songs where Mike sings lead. Nobody in Brian's band - especially Brian - can quite duplicate Mike's voice or sound, and that's critical to those songs.
Yeah, casual fans would be a little...caught off guard...if Brian injected a group of solo songs into the set. But I think Brian and the band would win them over - and the diehards, which are plentiful at Brian's shows, would love it!
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Post by Kapitan on Nov 20, 2019 14:15:20 GMT
There’s such an interesting experiment there. On one hand, there are presumably serious fans like myself who are getting pretty sick of Brian Wilson shows and require some kind of novelty to attend again. That’s where the full-album, or era-specific, etc., shows can help. And that’s where the “more solo songs” idea could work. (Though I’m not just turned off because the non-themed shows feature fewer deep cuts than they did 20 years ago, but because Brian is a far worse singer than he was then, and I don’t like his current band quite as much as I did when it had the likes of Darian every night, Taylor, Scott, Nick, and Nelson. I’m good with Matt, though.) Would any potential loss of more casual fans be counteracted by more serious fans continuing to attend and/or potentially winning over some of those casual fans? Who knows…
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Post by Sheriff John Stone on Nov 20, 2019 14:24:35 GMT
I think things would remain about the same. 5-6-7 solo songs isn't gonna make THAT much of a difference, not enough to make more people attend the show, and not enough to make people walk away disappointed, never to return.
You will always have a certain mix, a certain percentage of fans who attend BW solo for different reasons - BW diehards, BB fans who want to hear that music performed, people who just want to see a legend, younger fans who are just discovering this BW they read about, and fans who just want to enjoy a night out (dinner/spending some time with friends/going to a concert). That won't change because Brian is performing "South American". Now, "California Role"?
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Post by Kapitan on Nov 20, 2019 15:04:37 GMT
I like it! It’s funny because every time anyone lists favorites, a few are among my most hated...
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Post by lonelysummer on Nov 21, 2019 2:19:52 GMT
I like it! It’s funny because every time anyone lists favorites, a few are among my most hated... Yeah, that's true for me as well. Maybe Brian and the band should work up a version of Too Much Sugar for the 2020 tour! I doubt you'd hear many people complaining, though, if Brian was doing Melt Away or Lay Down Burden.
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